What Audio?

8th December 2004, 22:06

Already got a good head unit in the car but want new speakers. Want to get Speakers in the front doors and on the parcel shelf, what size do I need? Any particular make? Do I need anything else?
Help

8th December 2004, 22:09

Hmm. was gunna start a new topic bout the same thing, i also need to know is there any particular speakers that anyone can recomened as im replacing mine too

8th December 2004, 22:18

If your upgrading door speakers i would go for Infinity....they are the loudest brand i've found!

8th December 2004, 23:54

agreed, Good front set of infinity components would go down a treat !!

8th December 2004, 23:58

gd quality of sound too as well i take it? same set for the rear ones as well then?

9th December 2004, 00:01

ye infinity are one of the leading!

Front Speakers Here

Rear Speakers Here

Thats the ones im putting in and they are loud!

9th December 2004, 00:02

Or if your after components....

Front Here

Ric

9th December 2004, 00:09

cheers lads

9th December 2004, 00:59

If i want to get speakers for the front doors and the parcel shelf, do i need an amp? How do i go about fitting them?

9th December 2004, 01:05

no amp needed if your just replacing the original front door panel ones, but im not sure bout the 6x9's in the back.

i dont think you need an amp, but you would need an amp if you were puttin a sub in.

9th December 2004, 01:09

Im new to all this, but what does an amp actually do? Is it simple to wire everything up or would it be better to get some one to do it for me?

9th December 2004, 01:14

depends how electrically/technically minded you are, but if you buy yourself a copy of the Haynes Max Power manual then it tells you how to do all this sorta stuff in there, i think it was bout £20 when i ordered it.

Install places charge bout £50 for installin head units and stuff so i imagine it would be about the same price for an amp and same again for speakers, most of the guys on here have wired up some sort of ICE system so im sure one of them might be able to guide you if you get stuck

9th December 2004, 01:59

Go all out...get sum In-Phase components n run them off an amp, dont bother with 6x9's just get a sub n amp package instead.

6x9's suck! haha

9th December 2004, 02:42

What is an amp package? What do i get with it? How much they cost, roughly?
What size speakers could i get in the front doors? Was think bout 6*9 in the parcel shelf but not sure bout the parcel shelf????

9th December 2004, 02:49

Its up to you...if it was me id leave out the 6x9's. they just mix bass n treble. get 5.25's for the front or 6". ull need a new bracket for a 6 mind. get a sub and amp package, ull get the sub/box/amp/wires together at a decent price. i used to have a pioneer package i got from a magazine, cost £150 for the lot n it was awesome...bass just kept on cumin wit the volume. DONT skimp on components mind

9th December 2004, 02:55

like streetz says its up to you mate what type of set up you want to have, go to one of the big car audio cbntre, they can give you some guidance as well as to what you want to put in your car and give you and idea on price as well

9th December 2004, 03:49

Quote:

Im new to all this, but what does an amp actually do?

An amlifier does what it says. The head unit is only capable of sending out a certain watt of power. The more watt then the lourder and more powerful the sound is.

The amplifier has an input from the PreOuts on the head unit. Then the amplifier in turn converts this and puts it out in watts to the speakers. the higher the RMS watt output then the power you will have! You ideally need to match the RMS watts to the RMS required by either the speakers or the subwoofer

Quote:

What size speakers could i get in the front doors? Was think bout 6*9 in the parcel shelf but not sure bout the parcel shelf????

On a saxo you get 13cm speakers in the front and 10cm speakers in the back!

you don't necccessarily need 6x9's - if you put nice high quality front and rear door speakers then your sound will be amazing! check my links i made earlier in this post for the speakers i am getting (powerful)

Quote:

i dont think you need an amp, but you would need an amp if you were puttin a sub in.

correct in this...you do not need an amplifier for the front door speaker or the rear door speakers. not unless you have changed the holding pod to fit alrger speakers that will need more power than what the head unit will put out but this is unluckly unless your going to enter a competition!

hope that all helps clear things up

9th December 2004, 05:12

streetz: thank goodness the message of 6x9's being rubbish is spreading

9th December 2004, 14:35

I just bought a car, it came with a head unit and speakers in the front. What do you think is best replace the front and the back? Any ideas?

9th December 2004, 14:41

ok...what is your budget? do you want tweeters as well (components)?

9th December 2004, 14:46

I dont know what anything is really, you will have to explain to me what they are. Just want to firstly get speakers i nthe back then upgreadethe front ones. Was looking at some 600W 6*9's? any good?
Will they have to match the power output of the head unit?

9th December 2004, 15:16

Ok...lets start at the basics:

Head Unit
As you know the head unit palys the cd's, radio and all that. in a head unit is a built in amplifier. The amplifier is small and not very powerful. however it is mainly powerful enough for upgraded front and rear panel speakers. In a decent head unit they pump out 40 to 52watt RMS. the difference between the watt rating and the RMS rating is:

RMS - this is the continuous output feed that the radio can produce.
WATT RATING - this is what the device (whether speakers or amps) can produce at a peak! meaning it won't always put this power out but is capable of peaking at that for a short time.

Front Speakers
Front speakers in a saxo are 13cm standard. If you want front sound in the car (everyone does obviously) then you need to upgrade these. Earlier on i posted links to good Infinity ones.
Now most good front 13cm speakers can pump out on average 55watt RMS and up to 200watt peak. Now say you got a head unit that puts out 52watt RMS...you will see that the head unit meats the requirements to power that speaker at its max load! 55RMS to 52RMS (figures are nearly the same)

Rear Speakers
The default size is 10cm on a saxo. Now rear speakers are smaller so obviously it means a bit less power, tho not much!
a good set pumps out 50watt RMS and peaks at 150watt. again you will see that the head unit will be able to power these without an amplifier!

6 x 9's
the theory of 6x9's being good is starting to fade out. Yes they are extremely loud but the sound will be oming from behined you and with good door speakers you can get equally as good sound (sound will be hitting you direct) My advice...don't spend money on 6x9's at the minute! Also if you bought a good set of 6x9's your going to need to buy an amplifier!

Components
Components are the same as front speakers except they have 2 extra devices. Crossover device and tweeters. The point of components is so that frequencies can be played better with the tweeters. also tweeters are located at your level of your head in the car mainly so sound is sent from all directions meaning it being louder. Personally i have been in cars with and without them and they didn't make a big difference!

Subwoofer
A subwoofer as you know creates the bass or called the beat! it provides depth to the song. now depending on your taste - treble with a bit of bass or bass with a bit of treble - it will depend what you go for. If you want a bit of nice bass i would go for 1000 to 1500watt subwoofer. Now as you know the head unit would never power this so you need to get an amplifier. The RMS rating of the amplifier needs to match the RMS of the sub. the RMS ratings are available on any website with good details.

Amplifiers
As said earlier the amplifier just makes the output large for the devices attached. the sound feed is brought in from an RCA pre-out on the head unit. A good head unit will have at least 2 but you ideally want three (always alloy for expansion with a head unit) amps have different ratings...for a sub the RMS output from 1 channel would need to be 300 to 500watt RMS. Amps come in many styles - mono, 2 channel, etc... 2 channels means that you can connect 2 devices to it and so forth. On most amps you can bridge the 2 channels together to make one channel. Hence giving a large pwoer ouput but also allowing you to change the setup at a alter date. So BUY A GOOD POWERUL amplifier

Advice
buy the BEST head unit you can afford. the head unit is what controls the whole car audio. if you buy a poor head unit and good speakers, etc... you are defeating the purpose. buy a good head unit with 4-VOLT pre outs x 3!

9th December 2004, 19:53

i dont mean to pick holes but there has never been a headunit that has put out 40>50 watts RMS ever and there will probably never be one.

Components make a huge difference, tweeter placement is essential and round your head or head level is not best as your bombarded with extra loud treble.

Your listening on the 6x9s, excellent

I think your rating recommendations on subs is to high, you dont need that sort of power for even a little bass.

thats all

9th December 2004, 20:31

Ok then, that helps, So what would you recomend I do? Just get components? And set them up on the parcel shelf. Just wait to aim for something simple, but effective first. like installing speakers in the rear, but good ones. No amp or sub yet. What power, make, model is best?

9th December 2004, 20:52

if you really want good sound, start with the front. Put a half decent set of components in there and for now you can run them off the head unit until you can afford to amp them.

9th December 2004, 20:59

In-Phase or Lanzar components are the best ive heard...especially wen u consider price! but sayin that they will both cost u over £100.

Ive got a mate whos had both Infinity n In-Phase in his car n the In-Phase ones were best all the way. I got Lanzar in my car and i cant fault them but they are a bit more expensive again.

Dont bother with anything in the parcel shelf ESPECIALLY if ur puttin new rear speakers in. parcel shelf speakers are a waste of time.

If i was you id just get new front components runnin off an amp, disconnect the rears n get a decent but cheap sub/amp. thats as simple and effective as your goin to get!!

9th December 2004, 21:13

the way i look at it (not arguing) but dads car has a bose sound sysetm in it and the sub in it is big power! the sub never runs at full capacity and still produces a big thump!

the reason i say such a big sub is because if he was to use a smaller sub at a higher level to get the same thump then he will loose quality. if he buys a bigger sub and uses it at a lower volume level then the quality of the sound will be alot better

perfect example....standard car speakers need to be turned up very loud to have high volume....and they start to crackle! the upgraded speakers are way more powerful and he might only use them at half the pwoer but the illusion is that they are louder because the quality is much better at a certian level!

sorry about that head unit mistake there!

9th December 2004, 21:24

Well i dont have ANY speakers in the rear of the car at the mo, so would firstly like to get some there. Where shall i put them, and what size/ ones?
So if my head unit is only 30RMS (not sure what it is, it came with the car) I can only out speakers in upto 30 RMS?

9th December 2004, 21:29

****edited******

ok the head unit i got is 30watt RMS output constant! 52watt peak!

Apologize to everyone!

9th December 2004, 21:32

forgot...the rear space in a saxo will take 10cm speakers! the rear speakers go behined the grill in the side panel!

to get at it do the following:

-Remove the door seal that goes up the door pillar
-Remove the rear window seal along the bottom
-from the bottom of the door pillar pull the black panel out...there is 3 clips that hold it in...just work your way up!
-Remove the bolt that is holding the rear seat belt to the base of the car (under the rear seat)
-now tilt the rear seat forward a bit!
-to get the rear panel totally off...pull the plastic up (like tilt it) and work it out! it will come off if your patient!

Quote:

So if my head unit is only 30RMS (not sure what it is, it came with the car) I can only out speakers in upto 30 RMS?

No...you can put 100RMS in if you want...but the head unit will not be able to use the full capacity of the speakers!

(its a bit like..your car can hold 60 litres of fuel but you only put 20litres in the tank!)

9th December 2004, 21:39

One prob, I have a Pug 106
Any help now?

9th December 2004, 21:44

ohrite...so there is no rear pod built into the 106 panels?

9th December 2004, 21:56

Not sure really, aint been able to check it out. Where else could i fit speakers in the rear?

9th December 2004, 21:58

well if theres speakers in the bak there must be pods to put them in...saxo's...pug's...same car mun!

9th December 2004, 22:09

ye check if your car has speakers in the back!

if not then you should look at 6x9s to put in rack! not less you want to get the car customised to have pods, etc..

9th December 2004, 22:20

So there should be space in the rear doors for speakers? And in there u recommend I put in 6*9's? And they will run fine off the head unit? What is that max RMS output I can get then?

9th December 2004, 22:22

Sorry one thing i forgot, what does 'put in rack' mean?

9th December 2004, 22:26

Ok, just checked the car. There are speakers in the rear doors, just they dont work. Maybe they aint hooked up, or maybe they bust? i dunno, kno how i can check?

9th December 2004, 22:59

rite...you do have rear speakers in the panel so forget totally about 6x9's!

you can fit 10cm speakers in there i think (will confirm later) and get about 50RMS output power and 160watt peak power! Which is more than enough!

don't worry about them speakers...you'll be replacing them anyway!

9th December 2004, 23:32

SO where is the best place to get these 10cm speakers? Would they be the same size for the front ones? Any particular ones? Dont suppose some one could tell me how to fit em? IS it easy, or a complicated process?

10th December 2004, 05:15

www.caraudiosecurity.com

they are extremely cheap ad cheap delivery too.

mate...i'm checking clarion website and they say the 106 has 10cm speakers in the front and that the 106 does not have speakers in the rear? you definately sure the speakers are there?

Infinity is the brand you want for good loud door speakers!

its easy enough to fit them however if you have a limited understanding take them to a professional and get it done rigt...then they are responsible for the mistakes or the damage if they cause any!

10th December 2004, 05:49

106 defo has 13cm front speakers and defo 10cm rear speakers (where applicable, i know for sure that the gti and quiksilver have rears)

better brands out there than infinity but i agree for a decent brand at decent money infinity are good, very clear but not as bassy as JBL IMO

a particular favourite ice site of mine is car audio direct not the cheapest but excellent site often with reviews from buyers on products

10th December 2004, 14:12

to be honest see all these caraduiodirect and caraduiosecurity.....are they not all linked in a way? to the same data feed?

ye infinity are good at a price...if we want quality we'll go for bose! but the car would have to go back to the factory...as they don't sell their products to the public!

10th December 2004, 16:22

i wouldnt put bose at the top of my shopping list either

i dont honestly know if security and direct are linked to be honest, i have always had good dealings with direct so always recommend them

10th December 2004, 16:35

you wouldn't put them at the top of the list??? why?? they are the worlds leading in car audio!

have you ever been in a car with a full system? the quality of the sound is incredible!!!

10th December 2004, 16:49

hmm first time i have ever heard anyone say that bose is the leading figure in car audio and the general opinion of them is over priced and very sub standard sound for the price you pay

10th December 2004, 16:56

thats because not many people have the equipment!! you can only get it fitted when you custom order the car! they are so good that they wont let the general public buy their equipment incase they fit it wrong and make it sound bad!

they wont even let mercedes engineers fit the things! they bring in their own technicians to do it!

the sound is far from sub standard...it is out-standing! its as loud as any of my mates car ICE systems and one them spent 3000 on an ICE system!

10th December 2004, 17:03

so loud defines good? have a search on www.talkaudio.co.uk and see what people think. Some people on there have spent countless thousands on systems and would not waste money on bose and neither would i. So what they dont sell to the public, that does not dictate how good they are. there is a company up here who does home installs car installs who sell to the public and they would absolutely wipe the floor with bose, though i forget their name they do the installs in some of the austin martin range, bentley etc...

no offence intended btw

10th December 2004, 17:19

no...i aint meaning to argue...im just saying that bose is good..i listen to music through it everyday!yup it is loud and crystal clear!

www.talkaudio.co.uk....its a brill website but the reason ppl slag it is because they dont have a bose system!

If you was to order my car from factory then i would buy one over any equipment available!

10th December 2004, 17:30

fair enough if you like then you get it

damn its good to be able to have a sensible discussion wihtout it degenerating into a slanging match

maybe the internet is changing....nah we must just be that good

10th December 2004, 18:01

yup..it is good being able to talk and not slaggin by the end of it!

10th December 2004, 18:42

Well mine def has rear speakers, so any websites where i can get em from???

10th December 2004, 18:48

car audio direct,car audio security,cel-direct,mcs-direct

10th December 2004, 19:03

The model i got is a 1.1 (* Zest 2. It has got rear speakers, just what size? can anyone check this out for me? I duunno where to start.

10th December 2004, 19:29

they should be 10 cm (4 inch)

10th December 2004, 20:51

Some one else said earlier on in the topic that the front ones were 10cm and the back 13cm? Are you positive they are 10cm in the back?

10th December 2004, 21:34

yes, as far as im aware they have never came in another other size, i have worked on a few sax0's and 106's including different models.

The only difference im aware of is that on 5 dorrs the back speakers are 13cm as well.

Really though save your money and buy better front speakers you do not need rear speakers

10th December 2004, 21:48

Well mine is a 5 door, so the speakers should be 13 cm? Im gonna get both sets done.

10th December 2004, 21:58

they should be 13cm then but to be extra sure i would take them out and measure them

15th December 2004, 20:52

omg there are so many wrong pieces of info throughout this thread its untrue

15th December 2004, 21:15

enlighten us brian

16th December 2004, 20:24

why dont u look in the hand book and it should tell you the size of the speakers in the front and rear.

if i was u id spend loads on the front den get a sub and amp package as 6 x 9s are such a hassle to fit and then u av to spend to get em to sound gud.

e.g

6 x 9s 70 quids

Parcel Shelf 70 quid or diy jobbie bout 2o quid

Den an amp that is decent 50 - loads

16th December 2004, 21:04

when i have time scott i will.
and as for bose being the best kit you can get, i very much doubt it, its good yes but not on the scale of some stuff out there. you have to remember most of the time a good sounding system comes from the instalation and not just the equipment.

and 6*9s are the devils love child and should all be burnt ( i would be happy to fry anyones 6*9s for them )

16th December 2004, 21:34

agreed on everything you said there. Im trying my hardest to preach the evilness of 6x9s but some people just dont want to listen.

My R6's have landed

hurry up the fat santa man my door builds are nearly done to

16th December 2004, 22:11

Quote:

and as for bose being the best kit you can get, i very much doubt it, its good yes but not on the scale of some stuff out there. you have to remember most of the time a good sounding system comes from the instalation and not just the equipment.

i will agree to disagree! you know why people don't like it..cause they can't afford the stuff! you ask majority of people the say it is the high end market of sound audio! and yes thats why it can only be bought at the factory so that it is properly fitted by experts and not the members of the public!

definately tell us how we're all wrong tho!

16th December 2004, 22:19

Ive just spent s**t loads on a new system...and i DIDNT waste the money on Bose!

And as far as 6x9's go...if i had my way id hook every set up to the biggest amp i cud get my hands on n crank it up till they POP! ! !

16th December 2004, 23:05

ye i will agree that 6x9's are a no go! and i ahve been telling alot of people not to go near them as they are a waste!

and the subs that most people put in will blow them anyway!