Help with HID!!!!!!

23rd February 2008, 18:40

hey guys, i was thinking of going for some new headlights and was looking alo9ng the lines of angel eyes, but then thought that a HID kit may be abit different and a better choice for visability in the dark ( as i have alot of very dark back roads round my way!)

im not exactly sure what iom looking at but i seen a kit in halfrauds for nearly 300notes!!

yet there is loads on ebay from 20notes up to 100notes, could you guys maybe point me in the right direction as i have no idea !!!

http://motors.search.ebay.co.uk/hid-...Z1QQsofocusZbs

cheers guys! rep given for any help or advice

23rd February 2008, 20:44

the ones at the top of the page for £79.99 are the ones im getting, my mate has them and he said they were easy to wire up and they look well cool, well worth the money and legal for mot.

23rd February 2008, 21:44

Sorry to burst the bubble but HID's will melt the plastic lense of the angels. Trust me

But if you saw my thread about ULTRA daylight kits, they are compatible with the ultra angel eyes but are very pricey!

23rd February 2008, 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by liam46

Sorry to burst the bubble but HID's will melt the plastic lense of the angels. Trust me

But if you saw my thread about ULTRA daylight kits, they are compatible with the ultra angel eyes but are very pricey!

think he meant angel or hid.

23rd February 2008, 22:24

Yeah just making sure he dont combine the both LOL

24th February 2008, 04:13

oh no i no that much lol they will jst b going behind standard headlamps, will these be ok yea???

24th February 2008, 07:57

yes mate, but from the looks of things you could get a similar kit from China or somewhere similar for alot cheaper

24th February 2008, 08:53

just been reading some previous threads on HID's and it looks as if they are illegal mate.

from what i understand the HID kits are meant to go with HID head lights. because saxo's dont have HID's as standard they dont have HID headlights and therefore seem to be ilegal as the beam pattern is scattered and can dazel other road users.

a few people on here have them fitted though. Baz's look mint, drop him a PM and see which kit he has

25th February 2008, 11:58

You want to make sure you get some Bi-xenons as the set i had last year only had main beam and no high beam, with the bi-xenons you get both hi beam and main beam. for abit more cash though

25th February 2008, 13:19

they're illegal for a fair few reasons. off the top of my head...

- you don't have headlight washers
- the beams will be the wrong pattern because of the different bulbs that the reflectors weren't designed for (like wearing someone elses glasses)
- you also need auto adjusting headlight levellers, or a car with self levelling suspension

there's a dvla site somewhere on the internet with all the proper legislation.

25th February 2008, 20:57

i was speaking to the guy that did the guides on how to fit them today and he was saying he has the 8k ones and he has never been pulled for them, this is because he has angled them to the floor rather than straight ahead.

25th February 2008, 21:47

i have hid's there the 6000k ones. no bother what so ever i have also been told it will pass a mot, By Seat themselves

25th February 2008, 21:54

didnt the seat come with them as standard though craig?

its the saxo headlights that made for the HID lights and cant direct the pattern properly so the pattern is scattered

25th February 2008, 22:35

my mate has hids and they are a good mod i think but they arnt any better visibility i didnt think

26th February 2008, 12:45

unless you have hid as standard, or you but a complete hid light unit including reflectors then it's illegal for the reasons i've already stated. because saxo headlamps don't automatically level, it means that they will be blinding other road users when you go over a bump etc.

26th February 2008, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich_Black_VTS

You want to make sure you get some Bi-xenons as the set i had last year only had main beam and no high beam, with the bi-xenons you get both hi beam and main beam. for abit more cash though

never new that cheers man !

...but surely if there e-marked there legal as most of them are.....

26th February 2008, 19:13

if your getting some get these

bi xeon for low and hi beam and made by bosch good price all in incl delivery is £65 ! i think these i could find the best value might get some !

26th February 2008, 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by baker556

never new that cheers man !

...but surely if there e-marked there legal as most of them are.....

it's not legal to fit these to a saxo as i've tried to explain because the beam pattern will be focussed in the wrong way.

also you would need to fit headlamp washers and automatic levellers.

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/drs/hidheadlamps

3rd March 2008, 15:01

You are spot on Sharpie, this video also explains it.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=yVuSSdZNsZw

I got these normal H7 bulbs from ebay (for my MGZS) that have a 7500K colour temp and I am well pleased with them plus they are legal

Only £8.99 for a pair plus a couple of quid delivery.

3rd March 2008, 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyZS

You are spot on Sharpie, this video also explains it.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=yVuSSdZNsZw

I got these normal H7 bulbs from ebay (for my MGZS) that have a 7500K colour temp and I am well pleased with them plus they are legal

Only £8.99 for a pair plus a couple of quid delivery.

so if you got just the bulbs can i do that also? as it says u have to have th conversion for them to run??

all im wanting is some brighter lights really, i cant see the problem if you dont have the pointed to the sky really!!

if i ever did get pulled for them id just say the car had them on when i got it

3rd March 2008, 15:30

jst watced that video....

so basically i cant go for HID, well my problem is, when i have my headlights on dipped beam they point down to about say 4 metres infront, for an example, when on the motorway and they have those chevrons in the lanes and the sign saying "keep two chevrons apart" well i cantg see 2 chevrons infront!!!!

and as for my high beam, well the low beam on my mg zr is better by far!

ive been under the bonnet and twisted the adjusted to the correct level but its no different......

any ideas wtf is going on lol

4th March 2008, 11:45

The bulbs I have are not HID, they are Xenon filled filement bulbs so are a direct replacement for standard bulbs. My old bulbs gave a bright light but like yours only a short distance in front of the car. These bulbs are not as bright but light up much more of the road. Here is a picture of the same bulbs in another Mk2 ZS to give you an idea

and they were from the car mod shop on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/H7-55W-7500K-P...QQcmdZViewItem

4th March 2008, 15:30

thank you mate!! i used to be a member of the xpowerforums also lol well i still am for my zr

4th March 2008, 16:12

i have my HID's aimed as low as they will go, and i still light up catseyes before 2 cars infront of me..

4th March 2008, 16:18

If you aim them properly theyre fine as Smiith says. Ive followed police, been heading stright at them, gone past parked ones looking for people to pull over and never had an issue.

Be responsible with them and youll be fine. This is talking from experience, not from reading some toss on google

4th March 2008, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxo_89

thank you mate!! i used to be a member of the xpowerforums also lol well i still am for my zr

No problem, I am a big fan of the ZR as well it is a lovely looking car.
After market HID's are fine till someone is dazzeled by them and has a nasty accident then I would be glad I don't have them!

4th March 2008, 23:49

yea its a 160 to mate

im stuck on what to do here as i really want HID's but i dont want to waste my money and be told to take them off!!!!!

5th March 2008, 00:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyZS

No problem, I am a big fan of the ZR as well it is a lovely looking car.
After market HID's are fine till someone is dazzeled by them and has a nasty accident then I would be glad I don't have them!

If you set them up correctly you wont have any issues

Not meaning to target your comment personally mate but it seems tobe the general impression these things are deadly.

If you allign the headlights properly, fit them securely and aim them low they are fine for other road users, and greatly aid you vision. As i said I could have been pulled many times and they pull you for anything round here, they pulled me for doing UNDER the speed limit on a dual carriageway before

5th March 2008, 00:40

wen you say allign your headlights properly, what exactly do you meen?? like the adjuster on it? 0-1-2-3 ???

i do want them like, want the main beam set aswell!

5th March 2008, 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben_Saxo

If you aim them properly theyre fine as Smiith says. Ive followed police, been heading stright at them, gone past parked ones looking for people to pull over and never had an issue.

Be responsible with them and youll be fine. This is talking from experience, not from reading some toss on google

it's not JUST the alignment that the issue. the toss on google is the department of transport site which states the laws. see my previous posts.

5th March 2008, 16:25

ok ok ok lol i dont want to be causing a fuss here!

so haway what is my best bet? i meen what are the BRIGHTEST bulbs you can buy which are going to be legal? as mine or rubbish!

Oh, and is it possible to adjust the level of the headlights a different way to using the adjust provided? as mine point to the floor on the highest setting...

5th March 2008, 16:31

just buy HID's best lighting mod u can do imo, they make soo much difference
all normal bulbs and xenon etc arent much of an improvment...

5th March 2008, 16:48

iv been stopped by the police because mine were aimed up, i aimed them down, he got the traffic cop down in the T5, and he said he see's no problem with them like that, said even haflway up they are still fine

5th March 2008, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharpie

it's not JUST the alignment that the issue. the toss on google is the department of transport site which states the laws. see my previous posts.

stop talkin pish.

police looked on the power box's on mine, they say DOT on em, Department Of Transportation.

as far as police are concerned, that makes em legal enough.

end of, i win.

me and benjamin know, so

5th March 2008, 17:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by smiith

stop talkin pish.

police looked on the power box's on mine, they say DOT on em, Department Of Transportation.

as far as police are concerned, that makes em legal enough.

end of, i win.

me and benjamin know, so

is this true?? which ones do you have mate??? im looking for a kit with low and high beam bulbs if possible!

6th March 2008, 13:32

I don't think the police know much about them, in every day driving the worst that would happen if they were out of allignment would be a £30 fine for undue dazzle. If they know what they are looking at then you could get a VDRS to get them sorted then checked by an MOT testing station. At the end of the day they are illegal whether correctly alligned or not, but they do look very good!

6th March 2008, 14:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharpie

it's not JUST the alignment that the issue. the toss on google is the department of transport site which states the laws. see my previous posts.

Actual personal experience > Words on the internet.

If the police are happy, Im happy. At the end of the day its all down to personal choice, decats arent really legal, window tints on the front arent legal, playing music in your car which can be heard from outside of the car isnt legal, people still do it. Im not getting any police issues, no ones flashed their lights at me saying theyre too bright as they would if i had my headlights on.

6th March 2008, 15:53

Actual personal experience > The law

You are right, window tints that are too dark on the front aren't legal and if you are caught with them then you can get an immediate prohibition on your car, if you fail to see someone and kill them then you can get done for death by dangerous driving by condition. The same sort of thing *could* happen with illegal HID's

Murder isn't legal but people still do it!

The police work alongside VOSA who have more knowledge and equipment to test these things and take cars off the road straight away, sometimes requiring the car to be re MOT'd to lift the prohibition.

6th March 2008, 16:06

I have got Blue Xenon bulbs in mine. Not the full HID kit but they are a lot brighter then the standard ones.

I paid £18 for mine, came as a pack. The pack included:

2x H4 Xenon Bulbs for Dipped and Main Headlights.
2x H1 Xenon Bulbs for Foglights.
2x 501 Xenon Bulbs for Sidelights.

I will get some pictures up soon so you get see the difference. Also, these are legal to be used on a Saxo.

Mitch

6th March 2008, 16:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyZS

Actual personal experience > The law

You are right, window tints that are too dark on the front aren't legal and if you are caught with them then you can get an immediate prohibition on your car, if you fail to see someone and kill them then you can get done for death by dangerous driving by condition. The same sort of thing *could* happen with illegal HID's

Murder isn't legal but people still do it!

The police work alongside VOSA who have more knowledge and equipment to test these things and take cars off the road straight away, sometimes requiring the car to be re MOT'd to lift the prohibition.

Difference between murder and HIDs are that if the po po caught you murdering youd be in the shit, as Smiith says, they have no issue with my HIDs so i couldnt give a shit what some website says.

I see where your coming from mate but as long as their setup properly theyre perfectly fine and dont blind road users I have tested this by getting a mate to drive past and in front of me. Police have no issue with them, so I really dont see where theres an issue. Unless you say 'im breaking the law', but there is no solid legislation on HIDS currently because of national/EU grey areas its just a guide. Just like where they say playing loud music is illigal. Its only illigal is its deemed dangerous by the police.

6th March 2008, 16:48

Anyways im wondering here, if i did get a kit, with dipped and high beam bulbs (they are seperate aint they???) if the police DID pull me and ask me to take them out, wouldnt it just b a case of gettin home and taking the kit off and putting the old bulbs back in???? 10min job????

Quote:

Originally Posted by MitchFulla

I have got Blue Xenon bulbs in mine. Not the full HID kit but they are a lot brighter then the standard ones.

I paid £18 for mine, came as a pack. The pack included:

2x H4 Xenon Bulbs for Dipped and Main Headlights.
2x H1 Xenon Bulbs for Foglights.
2x 501 Xenon Bulbs for Sidelights.

I will get some pictures up soon so you get see the difference. Also, these are legal to be used on a Saxo.

Mitch

I thought you could opnly use Xenon bulbs with the Xenon adapter thing?? didnt think they would run with out it???

6th March 2008, 16:50

I know what you mean, I am very tempted to get a set myself as they look awesome, the cars I drive at work have them and the light they produce is much better than standard ones. The only thing that puts me off is the legality, as you correctly say I would probably never get caught and the biggest issue would be passing the MOT with them (which other ZS' have done).

6th March 2008, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyZS

I know what you mean, I am very tempted to get a set myself as they look awesome, the cars I drive at work have them and the light they produce is much better than standard ones. The only thing that puts me off is the legality, as you correctly say I would probably never get caught and the biggest issue would be passing the MOT with them (which other ZS' have done).

Like i said the, the aftermarket kits are just and adapter and the bulbs, when it comes to MOT time would it not just be easy enugh to change them back over again??? like you would with a decat for example???

6th March 2008, 16:53

Saxo_89, you can get normal filement bulbs with Xenon in them, mine are Xenon Plasma (whatever that is!) I think they have other gases in them as well but Xenon will give a whiter light than Halogen gas.

6th March 2008, 16:56

I think you can pop the old bulbs back in but the balasts would be attached in the engine bay somewhere but I can't see that you would have to remove them as well although the garage may know what you are up to! Someone who has had them fitted will be able to tell you if theirs passed or not.

6th March 2008, 16:56

I dont think there ever will be laws on these now anyway, all the new cars will have LED headlamps soon theyre just working out the last few issues. HID kits will becomes old technology

6th March 2008, 16:57

oh yea i no the ballest would be secured somewhere, but only by a couple of zip clips really, if they really did have a problem sure you could jst swap them over again lol

6th March 2008, 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben_Saxo

I dont think there ever will be laws on these now anyway, all the new cars will have LED headlamps soon theyre just working out the last few issues. HID kits will becomes old technology

There are laws on them already, just not easily enforced or known about.

6th March 2008, 17:24

Andy passing and MOT is not hard, The kits are so simple that all you have to do is unplug them from the lights and switch the bulbs over. It's literally a 10 minute job. They cannot say a word to you if the kit is in the car and not wired up because there not really 'working'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxo_89

oh yea i no the ballest would be secured somewhere, but only by a couple of zip clips really, if they really did have a problem sure you could jst swap them over again lol

Zip tied? your mad for it.. lol,

Mine are bolted on the inner wings, on each side there is 2 holes.. bit awkward to get too but they are there

6th March 2008, 17:27

oh ok lol you could not zip tie them then i guess lol how would you go around bolting them tho???

im usless with a tool box

6th March 2008, 17:29

double post

6th March 2008, 17:29

You can zip tie them, but zip ties don't really cut it for me. Personal preferance really, mine are hidden, one ballast near the ecu/water bottle and one near the fuse box. Best to just have a look when you get the kit..

6th March 2008, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by smiith

stop talkin pish.

police looked on the power box's on mine, they say DOT on em, Department Of Transportation.

as far as police are concerned, that makes em legal enough.

end of, i win.

me and benjamin know, so

if you read the DOT regulations on the DOT website you will find you are wrong.

edit: i can see why people want these because they look better and they're brighter but they're dangerous as they could blind other road users.

and as for all the "the police says they're fine" and "it passes its mot" talk that's fine and well. i have been stopped by the police and passed my mot with german plates on my golf and not ran into any problems - but they're still illegal. although unlike aftermarket HID kits, they don't danger any other road users.

6th March 2008, 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharpie

if you read the DOT regulations on the DOT website you will find you are wrong.

edit: i can see why people want these because they look better and they're brighter but they're dangerous as they could blind other road users.

and as for all the "the police says they're fine" and "it passes its mot" talk that's fine and well. i have been stopped by the police and passed my mot with german plates on my golf and not ran into any problems - but they're still illegal. although unlike aftermarket HID kits, they don't danger any other road users.

Did you even read my posts? If you allign them properly, they dont scatter or blind road users. Police dont think so, other road users done think so, as they would flash at me as if i had full beams on.

And Ive had a mate drive in front of me and past me the other way to make sure theyre ok and they were fine. I wouldnt put them on otherwise, I dont want someone blinded and crashing do I, even if I had no morals, they could crash into me.

This is what i meant by the actual experience comment, people saying they scatter is knowledge theyve gained from reading or hearing things, mainly from the internet which is about as reliable as the front page of The Sun, not from personal experience.

6th March 2008, 19:05

tbh, iv had police talk to me, and iv asked one who i know if he thinks they are alright, and he said theres no problem aslong as they aint aimed up at people.

End of the day, you dont have them, so dont have a clue how people react

The 'F1' Renaults come with HID's as standard now...

and for the record.. ANY front window tinting is illegal!

6th March 2008, 19:09

I dont think we can win mate, we'll just have to retreat and carry on driving around with our frikkin laser beam lights that give people cataracts

6th March 2008, 19:20

haha w00t lets!

and also.mine went through MOT today, and i left them in

but i know the bloke so maybe thats why lol, still only take 2 mins to change em, since you only need to take the bulbs out and unplug em, not the full system

6th March 2008, 19:38

I should point out that retrofitting HID systems to halogen lamps is not road legal. But then saying that most modifications to lighting systems are not permitted. Doing any modifications that make your car none road legal will invalidate your insurance and you can be prosecuted not only for driven such a car but also for not have appropriate insurance.

PS stock fitting bulbs that are called xenon bulbs are read halogen bulbs and as long as there E marked for the application being used they are still road legal in any normal halogen light unit.

6th March 2008, 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxo_89

Anyways im wondering here, if i did get a kit, with dipped and high beam bulbs (they are seperate aint they???) if the police DID pull me and ask me to take them out, wouldnt it just b a case of gettin home and taking the kit off and putting the old bulbs back in???? 10min job???

Depends how clued up the officer is and how friendly they are feeling. As its not a defect as such but a intentional infringement they could do you for it. Though you could play dumb and say it came like that and then you nay get lucky and they will give you a fix it. This is fine as you can take it home and fix it then you have to go to your local cop shop and prove to them you have rectified the problem. The only thing is if you get pulled again with the same problem you will be in trouble. But no police officer knows every reg and even fewer know what every cars stock spec is. So the chances of you actually getting done is slim. But it does not alter the fact you can get a very big fine and get in a lot of trouble if they do get you.

6th March 2008, 20:50

well i think i might just get myself some and if i get pulled say they wer on the car when i bought it, and just make sure i have them tilted down a level and test them with a friend!

anyone no which kit does the low and high beams??? and for the best price

6th March 2008, 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben_Saxo

Did you even read my posts? If you allign them properly, they dont scatter or blind road users. Police dont think so, other road users done think so, as they would flash at me as if i had full beams on.

And Ive had a mate drive in front of me and past me the other way to make sure theyre ok and they were fine. I wouldnt put them on otherwise, I dont want someone blinded and crashing do I, even if I had no morals, they could crash into me.

This is what i meant by the actual experience comment, people saying they scatter is knowledge theyve gained from reading or hearing things, mainly from the internet which is about as reliable as the front page of The Sun, not from personal experience.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AXracing

I should point out that retrofitting HID systems to halogen lamps is not road legal.

end of.

6th March 2008, 21:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by smiith

tbh, iv had police talk to me, and iv asked one who i know if he thinks they are alright, and he said theres no problem aslong as they aint aimed up at people.

End of the day, you dont have them, so dont have a clue how people react

The 'F1' Renaults come with HID's as standard now...

and for the record.. ANY front window tinting is illegal!

What he told you was wrong as already discussed they need the right lens, washer jets and self leveling (they make look fine till you put your mates in the back then dazzle everyone)

Also you can have tinted front windows as long as they let in 75% of the light.

6th March 2008, 21:17

i fitted hids to mine last year and took it for an mot at the citroen garage. low and behold they failed beacuse of the beam pattern, so i took them out and replaced with halford super bright bulbs. never had a problem with these and road legal.

6th March 2008, 23:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by AXracing

I should point out that retrofitting HID systems to halogen lamps is not road legal. But then saying that most modifications to lighting systems are not permitted. Doing any modifications that make your car none road legal will invalidate your insurance and you can be prosecuted not only for driven such a car but also for not have appropriate insurance.

PS stock fitting bulbs that are called xenon bulbs are read halogen bulbs and as long as there E marked for the application being used they are still road legal in any normal halogen light unit.

i told my insurance company (quinn) the exact light kit i got, even told them what was in the box, and they said thats fine..

6th March 2008, 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyZS

What he told you was wrong as already discussed they need the right lens, washer jets and self leveling (they make look fine till you put your mates in the back then dazzle everyone)

Also you can have tinted front windows as long as they let in 75% of the light.

laws changed about tinting a while back tbh.

and no back seats... no problems

7th March 2008, 00:07

come on then guys, which kit has the low and high beam bulbs???

7th March 2008, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharpie

end of.

Well theyre declared, and my insurance company had no problems with them.

All points have been made on both sides, you can choose to belive what you read on the internet, I choose to belive the reality.

7th March 2008, 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by smiith

i told my insurance company (quinn) the exact light kit i got, even told them what was in the box, and they said thats fine..

It still does not make it legal or make you covered. I could phone up my insurance company and tell them I am going to use my Yokohama Y801 tyres. Now youmay think ok fine Im now covered. The only think is these are not legal to use on the public road in the UK. So even though I had declared them my insurance would be invalidated by the fact I am driving a none road worthy car. Have a lock at the terms and conditions of your policy.

7th March 2008, 18:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by smiith

laws changed about tinting a while back tbh.

and no back seats... no problems

It hadn't changed last week when I assisted VOSA with a road safety check. I think you mean you can't add a tint to the front windows (clear glass only lets in about 86% of light and manufacturers usually have a tint that is at or near the legal limit so adding a tint would then take it over the 75% (or 70%) limit. It is however ok for them to be tinted as most new cars come with tinted windows.

Can't argue about your Xenons being affected by your mates though!

7th March 2008, 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharpie

if you read the DOT regulations on the DOT website you will find you are wrong.

edit: i can see why people want these because they look better and they're brighter but they're dangerous as they could blind other road users.

and as for all the "the police says they're fine" and "it passes its mot" talk that's fine and well. i have been stopped by the police and passed my mot with german plates on my golf and not ran into any problems - but they're still illegal. although unlike aftermarket HID kits, they don't danger any other road users.

Well said