Dyno time

  1. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #1
    Had the rolling road for today so i did some experimenting and thought i'd let you guys know the results..first off its a 1998 single plug VTS with a powerflow cat back exhaust and raceland filter.
    90bhp at the wheels, 130bhp at the fly, 113lbft torque

    Put the original air box on, and it was +/- 1bhp , and +/- 1lbft all the way up the rev range, so for what, £70 odd quid, your gaining about 1bhp.

    But, the 99p air filter from kamracing (The red one), jubilee clipped to the end of the throttle body was interesting.
    92bhp at the wheels, and 132bhp at the fly, 116lbft torque!
    So for 99p, I gained 6/7lbft torque & 5bhp from 2900rpm to 3600rpm, the power matched the raceland and O/E airbpx all the way up the rev range, and at the top end of the scale added 2bhp.

    Must say it is noticeable on the road aswell. So there you go! for 99p you can get good midrange gains and better performance than the o/e airbox and what i must say is a waste of money unless you like the noise - the raceland enclosed

    http://www.kamracing.co.uk/manufactu...ction-897.html

    Edit: Oh, and i did 2 or 3 runs with each to get averages and to see if it wasn't a '1 off'
  2. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #2
    99p for an air filter? There's no pic on the web link, what exactly are we talking about here? Also, are you saying that you took all induction kit type stuff off, and just popped the air filter right onto the throttle body?
  3. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #3
    It's the red filter which is inside this induction kit
    http://www.kamracing.co.uk/manufactu...r-vts-142.html

    And yes, i just popped the filter right onto the throttle body, nothing else
  4. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #4
    Interesting...
  5. Established Member Joined: Aug 2007 southampton Posts: 2253 saxo vtr
    #5
    yer but on a rolling road you have a fan blowing cold air straight into the filter, in real life the bonnet would be shut and it would be sucking hot air
  6. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #6
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stendog View Post
    yer but on a rolling road you have a fan blowing cold air straight into the filter, in real life the bonnet would be shut and it would be sucking hot air
    Cold air intake from the grill to the filter would be fine. I'll probably do some more with the bonnet shut
  7. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #7
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stendog View Post
    yer but on a rolling road you have a fan blowing cold air straight into the filter, in real life the bonnet would be shut and it would be sucking hot air
    Matty did mention this though: "Must say it is noticeable on the road aswell."
  8. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #8
    It is...before i did this testing i had no filter just a bare throttle body, then i fitted my newly aquired raceland enclosed and went for a test drive, came back and told my dad it felt slower, so he suggested i stuck it on the dyno, and i was right, it was down on power & torque
  9. L-plater Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 46
    #9
    Raceland filter's always gonna be shit. Use a green cotton or a K&N
  10. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #10
    Yeah green cotton straight on the throttle body may even be better as it's larger
  11. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #11
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Matty-VTR View Post
    Yeah green cotton straight on the throttle body may even be better as it's larger
    I took my car out for a spin not too long ago, and I had nothing on the TB. From what I remember, the can seemed to lose a lot of torque...
  12. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #12
    Yours is a different spec to mine lol, what you got on your engine normally?
  13. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #13
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Matty-VTR View Post
    Yours is a different spec to mine lol, what you got on your engine normally?
    As far as induction goes, I'm using a Green filter, with an Ecosse fibreglass enclosure, and a samco hose pipe leading to the TB.
  14. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #14
    hmm thats wierd yours seemed to lose torque..is yours cammed? I suppose our engine specs are different afterall lol
  15. Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Jun 2007 Maidstone, Kent Posts: 4928 Clio 197 Cup
    #15
    You got 90 BHP ATW which was 130 ATF.

    Isn't the standard output of a 16v ATW's around 88-90 BHP?
  16. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #16
    Depends which rolling road you go to mate..cars dont always make the standard quoted power. For example ep3 type R's make 183bhp atf on my dads rolling road instead of the quoted 197bhp?
  17. L-plater Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 30
    #17
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Matty-VTR View Post
    Depends which rolling road you go to mate..cars dont always make the standard quoted power. For example ep3 type R's make 183bhp atf on my dads rolling road instead of the quoted 197bhp?
    Thats a VERY low output for an EP3, i've seen 1 make as much as 220atf, while most make around 200.
  18. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #18
    Over exagerating rolling roads They all give different readings though..220 seems way out
  19. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #19
    I was quite proud of the 147 I made on your dad's rollers...
  20. Frequent Poster Joined: May 2008 bournemouth Posts: 582 saxo vtr, mk3 fiesta 1.1 - 2.0 zetec project
    #20
    only 90bhp at the wheels for a vts? i thought they were like 120 summin or 130 at the wheels?
  21. Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut
    #21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GRPerformance View Post
    Thats a VERY low output for an EP3, i've seen 1 make as much as 220atf, while most make around 200.
    standard, the rollers seem a bit out imo.
  22. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #22
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by landanimal View Post
    only 90bhp at the wheels for a vts? i thought they were like 120 summin or 130 at the wheels?
    No, 120 at the fly.
  23. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #23
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ryan View Post
    standard, the rollers seem a bit out imo.
    I can't comment on their accuracy, but I did notice that Dave (Matt's dad) run them with much more load than I've ever seen before. My car almost didn't get out of the 2000 - 3000rpm range. In thoery, this is a good thing, as power isn't wasted spinning up the flywheel. When I was at Wayne's many moons ago, his rollers where the opposite. He ran in 5th gear as opposed to the normal 4th, but he didn't use much load at all. Even in 5th, it would rip through the rpm like nobody's business.
  24. Frequent Poster Joined: Sep 2005 norwich United Kingdom (England) Posts: 821 2003 posi VTS
    #24
    What transmission losses are you using?

    90 atw to 130atf seems like a huge loss imo, thats almos 45%
  25. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #25
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ryhornvtr View Post
    What transmission losses are you using?

    90 atw to 130atf seems like a huge loss imo, thats almos 45%
    31% ...
  26. Frequent Poster Joined: Sep 2005 norwich United Kingdom (England) Posts: 821 2003 posi VTS
    #26
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Toad View Post
    31% ...
    Oh, i did it the other way round. Still bloody high though.
  27. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #27
    i've got a vtr gearbox? don't know what difference that would make though...not too clued up on transmission losses etc

    Getting a vts box at the weekend though!

    Toad if i get anywhere near your figure i will be chuffed!
  28. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #28
    Are you using a VTS? With a VTR gearbox?? {shakes head}
  29. Frequent Poster Joined: Jan 2008 Cheltenham Posts: 920 Silver VTR & Gunmetal Grey VTR
    #29
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Toad View Post
    Are you using a VTS? With a VTR gearbox?? {shakes head}
    Indeed i am! I bought the car with a fooked clutch apparantly...took it apart and the clutch was fine and the gearbox was fucked which was actually a 1.1 gearbox! So i had no choice but to put in the vtr box i had lying around.

    Will i notice much difference when i put the vts box in at the weekend?
  30. Established Member Joined: Mar 2008 Heald Green, Stockport Posts: 1721 black/yellow vtr
    #30
    thats impressive for the price
  31. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2007 Reading Posts: 8980 French tin can
    #31
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Matty-VTR View Post
    Indeed i am! I bought the car with a fooked clutch apparantly...took it apart and the clutch was fine and the gearbox was fucked which was actually a 1.1 gearbox! So i had no choice but to put in the vtr box i had lying around.

    Will i notice much difference when i put the vts box in at the weekend?
    Sure will! The final drive is much higher in the VTS box, and the ratios are more apt too.
  32. Frequent Poster Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 810 2001 VTS
    #32
    Nice to see some back to back testing their matey! Good work!