2ltr Saxo???

21st November 2008, 01:05

Just finished putting a 2ltr mondeo lump into my mates Fiesta Si, little bit of ag but it just fell straight in, but it got me thinking.
As I recall Citroen made a 2ltr Xsara VTS or whatever it was called, anyway I was wondereing if it would be as easy to drop one of these lumps into a saxo, just like we did with the fiesta, or would it be too difficuilt?
As saxo was originally a pug I was wondering if the mounts would be all wrong, or would we be able to make something up. If anyone knows if it would work, or just a waste of time it would be appreciated

21st November 2008, 01:08

front end would be wayyy too heavy, would need alot of work to make new mounts for it, gearbox would need a new mount.

not worth it, power to weight would be the same as an S

21st November 2008, 01:09

its possible mate but its alot of work thats why most people just go for the 1.6 16v conversion

21st November 2008, 01:09

been covered MANY MANY times before.

Yes it can be done.

Is it easy. NO.

and please use correct sections of the forum thanks.

21st November 2008, 01:18

if you want to be different go for the 207 gti thp(turbo high pressure) lump

21st November 2008, 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob-C

if you want to be different go for the 207 gti thp(turbo high pressure) lump

i like that idea would prob cost alot too tho

21st November 2008, 01:24

maybe so but 175bhp standard.. gotta bbe fun!

21st November 2008, 02:23

yep would be fun vts cammed tho ftw

21st November 2008, 02:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob-C

maybe so but 175bhp standard.. gotta bbe fun!

biggest problem is with the newer engines they are an arse to wire in, use crappy electronic TBs which take alot of the feel away imo, and have ecus that are apparently a complete arse to try and map *according to sources a while back*

21st November 2008, 19:34

haha have fun gonna take ages to get it runnin if u try doin it

21st November 2008, 19:38

For the hassle involved you might as well go for a high spec VTS engine. Work out around the same price probs and you keep the balance of the car right

22nd November 2008, 00:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by lsto

Just finished putting a 2ltr mondeo lump into my mates Fiesta Si, little bit of ag but it just fell straight in, but it got me thinking.
As I recall Citroen made a 2ltr Xsara VTS or whatever it was called, anyway I was wondereing if it would be as easy to drop one of these lumps into a saxo, just like we did with the fiesta, or would it be too difficuilt?
As saxo was originally a pug I was wondering if the mounts would be all wrong, or would we be able to make something up. If anyone knows if it would work, or just a waste of time it would be appreciated

Got mate who has just dropped 2.0 ltr xsara lump into his 106 gti

its realy heavey on the steering!! but go"s well...........

23rd November 2008, 13:41

406 3l v6 lump, just make sure you have a custom suspension setup, with the correct spring rating and dampers with the correct dampning force for the weight of the engine.

23rd November 2008, 13:51

have a look at z cars saxo, not a citroen engine but a nice healthy civic engine

http://www.zcars.org.uk/saxo/index.htm

23rd November 2008, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Predator_VTR

have a look at z cars saxo, not a citroen engine but a nice healthy civic engine

http://www.zcars.org.uk/saxo/index.htm

5.5k for a conversion... pfft

23rd November 2008, 14:04

tbh its not that bad, thats with labour too

when you think a trottle bodied conversion on a vts lump is about 4k

23rd November 2008, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Predator_VTR

tbh its not that bad, thats with labour too

when you think a trottle bodied conversion on a vts lump is about 4k

oh its including the labour... bargain then imo!!

only if i had the guts to go ahead with something like that

23rd November 2008, 14:53

Definately got to think outside the box with this one.

Sure the engine would go in ok, some adjustments but the biggest ball ache is the substancial extra weight.

So as not to completely kill handling etc you'd be wise to really upgrade the suspension setup which of course could cost as much as getting the engine in in the first place

23rd November 2008, 15:06

the 2 litre engine requires a decent amount of fabrication to get in. When you consider all that work then would be worth looking at different 2litre engines that are lighter and more easily tuned.

23rd November 2008, 15:37

2L pug engine like out of the gti-6 is sits really low, it can be done but is alot heavier than the saxo vts engine and fucks up the handling.

you can get an 1800cc stroker kit for the vts block

that increases the engine capacity.

i have been looking at the new pug / bmw engine 1.6 16v 175thp
canny engine, can be tuned as well

test drove a 207gti and i was well impressed, comes on boost and gets great torque low down in the rev range and has an overboost when you are gunning it

looked like it would fit nice and snug in the saxo engine bay

pug207gti175 thp

new shape bmw cooperS also has the same engine

23rd November 2008, 21:54

I was looking at the new 1.6 lump in the 307, looks fun and drives well, though you'd need standalone management etc and realistically it's not financially viable.

God knows how a electronic TB has less "feel" than cable opperated unit. Unless the electronic one's fucked it should react quicker than the cable

24th November 2008, 02:50

cable should be instant???? pull one end boddie opens.... electric one must have a motor or actuator to open it so will be slower not noticeable tho

24th November 2008, 02:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by CampDavid

God knows how a electronic TB has less "feel" than cable opperated unit. Unless the electronic one's fucked it should react quicker than the cable

which would be why alot of cliosport owners tend to prefer mk1s on track due to having a cable throttle over elecrtonic isnt it.

Switching between either of my saxos and my 172, you can tell a big difference between the cable set up and the elctronic system, goes for a few I drove. I guess they all must have been fucked though lol

24th November 2008, 03:06

24th November 2008, 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan

which would be why alot of cliosport owners tend to prefer mk1s on track due to having a cable throttle over elecrtonic isnt it.

Switching between either of my saxos and my 172, you can tell a big difference between the cable set up and the elctronic system, goes for a few I drove. I guess they all must have been fucked though lol

Probably no need for the sarcasm there Ryan. I'm not a "hater" it was just an observation.

http://www.picoauto.com/applications...e-control.html

Electronic throttle should give a quicker and more acturate reaction from the ECU, meaning better pickup etc. The actuators should also be working a fair bit quicker than a cable operated butterfly, more precision will mean better feel. This is why Formula One cars have been on a fly by wire system for ages (I think Ferrari first bought it in in 1989) At a guess the Clio has a much slower response with the FBW throttle as it's designed as a road car for road use. Remapped surely the response time could be cut down and the lag taken out. You'd need to use something like the DTA system when running the 1.6 turbo PSA lump in a Saxo so that wouldn't really be an issue

The cable will also have it's own amount of lag. This shouldn't affect something like a Saxo but becomes a big issues on bigger things, like aircraft, where it was first used (hence the name fly-by-wire) as the lag in the throttle cable on a 747 would start to become noticable.