The Performance Guide

7th January 2009, 00:51

I had this idea for quite a while now, but havnt brought it up til now!

now i think i speak on behalf of most performnace modding novices when i say we dont have a clue how much extra performance we would obtain from adding certain parts, i.e cam's and exaust.

what i thought we could do is have this as a quick referance guide. lay it out in a table format or something similar. And also people giving small reviews on parts, for exaple the performance differance from different cams, like kent cams and newman i.e I feel that the NewmanCam is more reponsive on a 8v than the 16v

And also give reviews and performance figures on mulitple parts used, i.e I have got a gain of 10 bhp with de-cat exhaust and enclosed air filter on a mint vts

this is obviosuly going to be a rough guide, as it would depend on the conditon of the engine and other exisiting mod's.

Once a review or figuers have been posted by a user i will edit them into this post so itis easly readable.

this is just an exaple of what i have planned in my head, it will need to be changed as all the info is made up as i dont know! so tell me the info and i will add the info in!

Citroen saxo |NewmanCams||KentCams||Enclosed air filter||De-cat||4-2-1||ThrottleBodies||Turbo|

1.0i (std 50bhp)_+15bhp______+15bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp

1.1i (std 60bhp)_+15bhp______+15bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp

1.4i (std 75bhp)_+15bhp______+15bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp

1.6i (std 90bhp)_+15bhp______+15bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp
(std 100bhp)___+15bhp_______+15bhp_____+5bhp________+5b hp

1.6i (st 120bhp)_+20bhp______+20bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp

1.5D(std 58bhp)_+10bhp______+10bhp_____+5bhp_________+5bhp

And if it would be helpful, i'll try and do one for torque and other suggestions ??

its not letting me finishe me example table, but im sure you get the idea!
now hopefully this wont be a waste of my time lol

Rob

7th January 2009, 00:56

I dont think you can be so generic, its a very good idea, to get show roughly what the gains are vs cost (if you added that too) but there is so much variation in different enclosed filters, serviced cars, then with the cams, remaps are specific to a car.

Good on you for taking the time to do this though.

7th January 2009, 00:59

i think this would help the people that posts threads asking 'what cam's there are to buy', 'how can i make my car faster', and 'has anyone else had this done to their car'

7th January 2009, 01:03

Yeah, like I have no idea what adding the induction kit and decat will do to my car, but going off that I am under the impression of maybe hitting 130? I dont want to be too hopeful but it gives a very rough indicator. With a lot of time and if people told you all their figures from mods it could be a very useful guide. With prices, you can see what mods are worth the cash.

7th January 2009, 01:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jorge-

I dont think you can be so generic, its a very good idea, to get show roughly what the gains are vs cost (if you added that too) but there is so much variation in different enclosed filters, serviced cars, then with the cams, remaps are specific to a car.

Good on you for taking the time to do this though.

thanks mate

there is alot more information that needd adding in, like maping aswel, but i wanted to keep it basic so people can understand what the hell i am on about lol

if someone could use their thinking brain and design a suitable table that would show all the model's of saxo's, differen parts and costs

in my opinion only the most popular, most used and best performance parts should be shown in the table, so nothing like homemade air filters or ebay superchargers lol

7th January 2009, 01:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jorge-

Yeah, like I have no idea what adding the induction kit and decat will do to my car, but going off that I am under the impression of maybe hitting 130? I dont want to be too hopeful but it gives a very rough indicator. With a lot of time and if people told you all their figures from mods it could be a very useful guide. With prices, you can see what mods are worth the cash.

yeah true, they're will people with the same car as you, and they may have done what you are planning on doing. So with them writing their figures onto this guide it will give you an idea of what you can hope to achieve

7th January 2009, 01:09

I think it is best posting it up in Excel or something similar, then saving it as an image. Trying to keep it evenly spaced on the internet will be prove a challenge.

7th January 2009, 01:13

yeah i was going to, but im on my mums comp and the excel isnt working and paint got wiped off

lol

so i'll re-do it when on my laptop

7th January 2009, 06:59

it's a great idea. but it's not possible really because every car is different and every mod is different.

if you put two cars that were identical in make model and mods they'd get a different reading dependant on how there driven looked after etc etc.

you'd be lucky to gain more than 3/4 bhp with your average induction like racelands bmc's.

different mani's will perform in different ways

you'd be able to get an average idea I guess

7th January 2009, 09:09

You could put a caveat or colour code to say these figures are "actual" and "estimated".

Then over time people can upload their RR figures before/after to get "actual" figures.

As said before, "actual" will still depend on each car and driver. But a good start well done man!

7th January 2009, 10:22

thought it was a really good idea because it gives you that rough average and for people who no very little about it *ie me this helps alot cheers

7th January 2009, 10:37

Its a nice idea but won't work as an accurate guide - making it less than useful

Say cams on a standard engine give +10bhp
and induction on a standard engine gives +5 bhp

induction on a camm'd engine doesn't necessarily give +15% bhp it may be more (or less) or not give any gain top end and improve midrange.

Tuning isn't really a shopping list.

7th January 2009, 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by KamRacing

Its a nice idea but won't work as an accurate guide - making it less than useful

Say cams on a standard engine give +10bhp
and induction on a standard engine gives +5 bhp

induction on a camm'd engine doesn't necessarily give +15% bhp it may be more (or less) or not give any gain top end and improve midrange.

Tuning isn't really a shopping list.

yeah that was my problem with my idea, i would need to incorpate combinations of parts used.

i was going to use the table as a rough estimate for the gain in bhp from parts

and then have reviews about the figuers cars acheive with these parts fitted to their cars, and also how it feels.

7th January 2009, 15:23

Unfortunately as people have said it does not really work. People can have very similar spec engines and get totally different outputs. With engines its very much in the fine detail of the actual spec and its execution that. For example I could say cams, throttle bodies, ported head and tubular exhaust manifold can give you 165bhp. Now am I talking about a 1360cc or a 1.6 16V? Both can get that from these modifications it would just take a lot more know how and have to be a very good job to get it from the 1360cc.

7th January 2009, 15:35

plus aswell some noobs may misread it
and add up all the numbers when buying the parts

could easily end up thinking a cammed engine will have gained over 40bhp is you sav 5bhp for mani 5 for exhaust few for the remap ect

plus they may think the cam is the best option and put one in a standard engine then wonder why they only got a few hp from it

plus as said no 2 cars are the same
and the amount of work you can do to engines youll end up with a huge table that people will struggle to translate

7th January 2009, 15:45

maybe its not so practicle then lol

7th January 2009, 16:11

or just get people to list engine spec with power output? like and engine spec thread?

7th January 2009, 16:13

that could be a plan tbh
a thread of what car what mods and a pic of your dyno graph so we can see whats what

7th January 2009, 16:23

Thats what the E-Garage is for.

You can view peoples modifications & compare it to their bhp, torque & quartermile outputs etc

http://www.saxperience.com/forum/garage.php?do=dyno

7th January 2009, 16:43

its a bit easier looking at a list of cars and mods rather than having to view every single persons car seperate imo.

ignore me, ive never looked at it till now @

7th January 2009, 16:45

i think its a good idea mate tbh. cant be so generic though imo