Standard VTS Verniers with 708 Cams

10th April 2009, 19:00

How do you know how/when theyre timed correctly,
as the standard verniers do not have markings on them for aftermarket cams.

Thanks.

10th April 2009, 19:11

You get a dti guage and time the cams up so the inlet and exhaust valves have the specified amount of lift at TDC.

10th April 2009, 19:13

^^ sorry didn't write much, am on the iPhone - can do it in more detail if needed.

11th April 2009, 11:33

please do

11th April 2009, 12:01

i'll post pics when i do mine tomorrow to help explain.

11th April 2009, 13:57

It's the same with aftermarket verniers, the timing marks on them don't mean much, apart from they make it easier to do it via the disc method, but using a DGI is a far better way anyway.

11th April 2009, 14:45

Remove the cam covers and the cambelt cover

Set up the dti guage by resting the tip on the relevant (inlet or exhaust)follower on cyl 1 or 4 - so that it reads 0 when the valve is fully open.

Then turn the engine over carefully and lock the bottom end off.

Now slacken off the relevant 3 camshaft bolts

Advance/retard the camshaft until the dti guage reads the original lift, less the amount at TDC to the camshaft manufacturers spec - maybe -1mm. Whilst holding it at the correct point tighten up the 3 camshaft bolts

Repeat the above for the other camshaft.

The cams are now timed in to the manufacturers spec - you can check the correct tdc by putting the dti against the followers.

11th April 2009, 14:49

Sorry if the above doesn't quite make sense - took the plunge to just write it on the iPhone. There are a few good guides on the Internet showing how to do it in more detail.

12th April 2009, 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by raunchz

Remove the cam covers and the cambelt cover

Set up the dti guage by resting the tip on the relevant (inlet or exhaust)follower on cyl 1 or 4 - so that it reads 0 when the valve is fully open.

Then turn the engine over carefully and lock the bottom end off.

Now slacken off the relevant 3 camshaft bolts

Advance/retard the camshaft until the dti guage reads the original lift, less the amount at TDC to the camshaft manufacturers spec - maybe -1mm. Whilst holding it at the correct point tighten up the 3 camshaft bolts

Repeat the above for the other camshaft.

The cams are now timed in to the manufacturers spec - you can check the correct tdc by putting the dti against the followers.

thats not the correct way to do it.

you need the DTI on the top of the lifter on cylinder number 1, when it is FULLY SHUT it should be set to 0 on the DTI.
you should have another DTI on piston 1 or 4, doesnt matter.
then set this DTI to 0 when the piston is exactly at the top of its stroke, TDC.
when this piston is exactly at TDC you can the adjust the relevant cam to the manufactures spec. i will post pics in a min.

12th April 2009, 20:34

Make sure you take dwell @ tdc into account, although in all seriousness i measured it and the lock on the crank was virtually bang on, so there's no point.

12th April 2009, 20:38

i stick a DTI on to make sure. its easier to use a DTI then piss on getting something in the locking hole imo.

12th April 2009, 20:46

forgot to get a pic of a DTIon the lifter.
but put 1 on piston 4 like this

and also 1 on the follower of which ever cam your doing on cylinder 1.

12th April 2009, 20:47

Get PH3s, just so happens theres a buy for them ! lol

12th April 2009, 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamsvts

thats not the correct way to do it.

you need the DTI on the top of the lifter on cylinder number 1, when it is FULLY SHUT it should be set to 0 on the DTI.
you should have another DTI on piston 1 or 4, doesnt matter.
then set this DTI to 0 when the piston is exactly at the top of its stroke, TDC.
when this piston is exactly at TDC you can the adjust the relevant cam to the manufactures spec. i will post pics in a min.

With the dti at 0 at tdc, how'd you measure say 1.25mm of lift at tdc? Does the dti go negative?

I've not timed up my cams yet so am looking to get the most accurate timing of them.

12th April 2009, 21:01

yes, DTI moves both ways.
you set it at 0 at TDC, then move your cam round till it is reading 1.25mm or what ever you want.

12th April 2009, 21:02

btw, you want be able to use a normal DTI, as you cant fit it in past the cam lobe, not sure if you can buy attatchments, but i just mate some.

12th April 2009, 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamsvts

yes, DTI moves both ways.
you set it at 0 at TDC, then move your cam round till it is reading 1.25mm or what ever you want.

Yeh cool, have yet to buy a dti so will have a little play when get it.

12th April 2009, 21:05

use a bit of welding rod

williams, with a short allen key it's very easy to get to the locking hole, i've only recently acquired the right tool, it's great

worth mentioning that you need to be at 90 degrees to the lifters face with the dti, to measure movement in the correct plane, otherwise if the DTI is facing perpendicular to the cam ladders, you won't be measuring the real valve lift as the lifters move at an angle in the head.

12th April 2009, 21:06

best to get 2. also, as you will prob know they are magnetic, and you need a good hold to get accurate readings. BUT, the head is alloy, which isnt magnetic haha, so i could a block of steel to lie across the coil pack bolt holes to give a steady reading.

12th April 2009, 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexR

use a bit of welding rod

williams, with a short allen key it's very easy to get to the locking hole, i've only recently acquired the right tool, it's great

worth mentioning that you need to be at 90 degrees to the lifters face with the dti, to measure movement in the correct plane, otherwise if the DTI is facing perpendicular to the cam ladders, you won't be measuring the real valve lift as the lifters move at an angle in the head.

yeah, thats why i made up a small rod to fit in the end of the DTI, i used some welding rod a few year ago but it didnt seem very rigid. i just turn down some steel then used a bench grinder to grind the edges down so it would fit in and sit on top of the lifters correct.

12th April 2009, 21:15

Matt @ QEP made a metal plate up for the DTI, just drilled some holes in it and bolted it onto the opposite cam ladder through the cam cover threads

Good idea on the rod idea!

I've gotta go through this ballache again soon

12th April 2009, 21:17

haha, i done mine today, took me about 1.5 hours from opening bonnet to shutting it

12th April 2009, 21:20

Pfft, that's a long time

Donate some 708s to a good cause? i need to do some testing!

12th April 2009, 21:23

hahaha, you still got that 25mm arb i sold you a few year ago? wanna swap for a 24mm? and a 21mm pugsport 1? haha

12th April 2009, 21:35

Nah Ryanal has that!

13th April 2009, 06:42

oh remember to tighten all the bolts down

if u dont u will have a saxo sitting on your m8s drive with no engine in it!!!!

13th April 2009, 08:56

haha yer you'd hate to get that far then kill the head