Best and cheapest way for 200 BHP

21st December 2009, 11:20

I have a saxo vtr and was wondering what the cheapest way of getting to 200bhp -sticking with the vtr engine or going for a vts. Im tempted by the vts engine but insurance and tax would go up a fair amount its a lot harder to just unbolt an engine when you may have a crash whereas bolt on bits are..

21st December 2009, 11:23

so if u were to get to 200 bhp would you not be telling the insurance about all the mods?

21st December 2009, 11:25

cheapest and easiest way New car with 200 as standard... then job done...

21st December 2009, 11:25

Possibly...the thought had crossed my mind... only if i stuck with the vtr though im with adrian flux though and they are pretty cheap anyway.

Really i just would like to now which would be the most cost effective and a turbo conversion is surely out of the question (2much £)

21st December 2009, 11:26

Your insurance is going to rocket with 200bhp whether it's a VTR or VTS mate.

For the price VTS engines can be had for it'll be cheaper to start with one of them.

Then to keep costs down you'll be looking at boost, N/A will cost you an even bigger fortune to get to 200bhp (just look at Ryan's car)

Can you do most/all the work yourself? You'll be looking at saving yourself a couple of grand there. Basic turbo kits start at £1600 iirc but you won't be seeing 200bhp with them. Sourcing the parts yourself/keeping an eye out for bargains and fitting them yourself could see you with 200bhp for £2000. But that's with some serious bargains and everything will have to be spot on to run reliably.

21st December 2009, 12:29

cheapest way is boost

but on the insurance comments tbh man either way it wont be cheap
best bet is for a policy like dboy had on his vts
set power limit but any mods allowed iirc he said it was
his was a 300 bhp limit
so anything he did to the car chassis wise ect was covered anyway
and engine was aslong as it didnt pip over 300 on rollers

21st December 2009, 12:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by hard_corejoeboy

Possibly...the thought had crossed my mind... only if i stuck with the vtr though im with adrian flux though and they are pretty cheap anyway.

Really i just would like to now which would be the most cost effective and a turbo conversion is surely out of the question (2much £)

You wont get 200bhp from a 1.6 without 2k+ spending on it.

How about something actually reachable, like 120bhp from the 8v, or 140-150 from the 16v.

cams and breathing mods. Anything more, get silly money.

21st December 2009, 12:39

Why not wait until you can afford a VTS, get that to around 150bhp and strip it out to give a good power to weight ratio and you will be surprised how fast it will be

21st December 2009, 12:43

why do you want 200bhp from a VTR....?? jus spend your ££ on a nicer car!

21st December 2009, 12:43

Tbh even Cams and breathing mods once mapped (if done properly) will cost you in excess of £1.5k

Cams £300-400
Remap £500+
Induction £100 ish
Exhaust Manifold £200-300
Exhaust System £150-200

Nothing is cheap these days

To strap on some ITB's after that you'll be looking at another £2k+ and may reach 165ish.

Plus then you'll probably need some sort of engine management to get the best from them. So even the cheapest P'n'P systems will cost you in excess of £600.

Some wilder cams and light-moderate headwork will help you see 170-175 and will set you back another £1.5-2k

After that, short of completely forged internals and serious headwork (we're talking £5k upwards here) you won't see much more.

Plus don't forget all the sessions with the ECU tuners to get it running the correct fueling etc.

This is on a VTS engine btw.

21st December 2009, 12:53

gaining 80-100 bhp on an engine that is not turboed as standard is an expensive task.

21st December 2009, 16:00

another dreamer thread, sighh..

21st December 2009, 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Dan-

Tbh even Cams and breathing mods once mapped (if done properly) will cost you in excess of £1.5k

Cams £300-400
Remap £500+
Induction £100 ish
Exhaust Manifold £200-300
Exhaust System £150-200

Nothing is cheap these days

To strap on some ITB's after that you'll be looking at another £2k+ and may reach 165ish.

Plus then you'll probably need some sort of engine management to get the best from them. So even the cheapest P'n'P systems will cost you in excess of £600.

Some wilder cams and light-moderate headwork will help you see 170-175 and will set you back another £1.5-2k

After that, short of completely forged internals and serious headwork (we're talking £5k upwards here) you won't see much more.

Plus don't forget all the sessions with the ECU tuners to get it running the correct fueling etc.

This is on a VTS engine btw.

Is a remap really that much?

21st December 2009, 16:29

get a vts conversion =120 bhp
exhaust
de cat
lose all the weight in the car
cams
remap!

21st December 2009, 16:32

My Rallye is cammed, Remapped, Enclosed filter and full supersprint system and i've got print out for 124bhp on an 8valve.

21st December 2009, 16:34

But that was before de-cat and enclosed so i'd say maybe 130bhp out an 8 valve if i'm lucky

21st December 2009, 16:36

Or you could just make sure you insure the car properly and not worry about cock length and bhp.

21st December 2009, 16:41

The rolling road I use at Northampton Motorsport charge £85 per hour + Vat. Usually takes 3 hours if the cams are correctly set up...

21st December 2009, 16:45

3 options:

1. Waste loads of money
2. Buy a faster car
3. Get driving tuition

A car is only as fast as the driver can peddle it.

Id place money on a well driver, stripped vtr with breathing mods, R888's & Bilsteins being quicker around most UK circuits than a numpty driving a 250bhp saxo turbo on Nankangs & apex springs....

21st December 2009, 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir_dave

3 options:

1. Waste loads of money
2. Buy a faster car
3. Get driving tuition

A car is only as fast as the driver can peddle it.

Id place money on a well drive, stripped vtr with breathing mods, R888's & Bilsteins being quicker around most UK circuits than a numpty driving a 250bhp saxo turbo on Nankangs & apex springs....

well said lol

21st December 2009, 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by pug106jb

The rolling road I use at Northampton Motorsport charge £85 per hour + Vat. Usually takes 3 hours if the cams are correctly set up...

yer they are, they are expensive for a reason though, as they are very very good at what they do.

never going to be cheap what every you do!

andy

21st December 2009, 18:37

Some brutal home made turbo bodge job with the turbo from a bus. And take the rear seats out

21st December 2009, 18:52

Just plumb in a modified nitrous/petrol powered leaf blower.

21st December 2009, 18:54

Just go an buy a car what's got 200 bhp...

21st December 2009, 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir_dave

3 options:

1. Waste loads of money
2. Buy a faster car
3. Get driving tuition

A car is only as fast as the driver can peddle it.

Id place money on a well driver, stripped vtr with breathing mods, R888's & Bilsteins being quicker around most UK circuits than a numpty driving a 250bhp saxo turbo on Nankangs & apex springs....

21st December 2009, 19:39

Mate, at the end of the day if you crash your fooked and your insurance will be void meaning your in a lot of toruble and will most likely face higher insurance for the rest of your life. Just wait until you can afford a faster car is the most simple way, or get the money together to do things properly and tell the insurance.

21st December 2009, 20:46

Halfords BOI!

21st December 2009, 21:22

Epic fail

21st December 2009, 21:47

oh dear. if you are planning on not insuring it then i wouldn't bother even trying. People that drive without insurance or invalid insurance deserve to have their cars taken off them and crushed.

Why do you want to get to 200bhp?

I suggest you have a read of some of the progress threads of members that have high spec saxo's and see how long and how much effort and money they have invested before thinking about doing anything.

22nd December 2009, 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexB

cheapest way is boost

but on the insurance comments tbh man either way it wont be cheap
best bet is for a policy like dboy had on his vts
set power limit but any mods allowed iirc he said it was
his was a 300 bhp limit
so anything he did to the car chassis wise ect was covered anyway
and engine was aslong as it didnt pip over 300 on rollers

Yes that would be the best way to insure a boosted car, Think insurance like that would be that cheap for the younger members my age helps out a lot.

As you said was a power limit of 300hp but i was surprised they never asked for a power graph print out they just took my word

and i was aloud unlimited mods on the car even a cage was covered.

Boost will be the cheapest way of getting 200hp but would still say getting a true 200hp will not be cheap.

22nd December 2009, 22:04

Who was that through Neil?

22nd December 2009, 22:10

Andy it was with Adrian flux and the under writer is equity red star.

22nd December 2009, 22:18

Definateee new car !!!

23rd December 2009, 16:50

Some frankly useless comments here as expected! Seeing as im nearly 26 years old i can afford a vts i can afford to insure one and im not a boy racer with halfords tatooed down the car. 200 i think would be a good target as with stripping etc could get down to nearly 250bhp/tonne the same as some of the fastest subarus that cost a bomb to tax insure and run. I would love to rub a driver of one of these cars nose in it driving round a track a heck of a lot quicker not because my mate in his turbo'd corsa can do the quarter mile in 13 secs! And any comments about my spelling and punctuation i couldn't give a rats ass about as im in a FOB in afghanistan and don't have a great amount of time to type just so we are clear on that one.
I love cars i love my car just want to talk about that if thats okay?

Also buying a car (like a civic type r) With 200bhp would be a lot slower than a saxo with 200bhp and would cost me more in the long run.

To the rest cheers for the helpful comments!

23rd December 2009, 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by hard_corejoeboy

Some frankly useless comments here as expected! Seeing as im nearly 26 years old i can afford a vts i can afford to insure one and im not a boy racer with halfords tatooed down the car. 200 i think would be a good target as with stripping etc could get down to nearly 250bhp/tonne the same as some of the fastest subarus that cost a bomb to tax insure and run. I would love to rub a driver of one of these cars nose in it driving round a track a heck of a lot quicker not because my mate in his turbo'd corsa can do the quarter mile in 13 secs! And any comments about my spelling and punctuation i couldn't give a rats ass about as im in a FOB in afghanistan and don't have a great amount of time to type just so we are clear on that one.
I love cars i love my car just want to talk about that if thats okay?

To the rest cheers for the helpful comments!

Quote:

Originally Posted by hard_corejoeboy

I have a saxo vtr and was wondering what the cheapest way of getting to 200bhp -sticking with the vtr engine or going for a vts. Im tempted by the vts engine but insurance and tax would go up a fair amount its a lot harder to just unbolt an engine when you may have a crash whereas bolt on bits are..

id say your initial post about its harder to unbolt an engine in a crash kinda sums up why everyone told you to consider the insurance before trying to get 200bhp

if you want 200bhp NA, budget for 6-7k + and thats before you sort the chassis

23rd December 2009, 16:57

I was hoping for 4-5k but i think i'll shop around

23rd December 2009, 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by hard_corejoeboy

I was hoping for 4-5k but i think i'll shop around

If you want it NA.

the engine block and head alone built will cost 4-5k, then you have the price of bodies + ecu + mapping to come

boosted is the way if you are on a small budget, 200bhp can be done on standard internals.