ditching the servo

1. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

   #1 9th May 2010, 21:37

   well i`ve been considerng this for a while... and have looked at the compbrake bias pedal box for the 106 but tbh.. i think its a bit OTT for my needs..
   
   then i spotted this:
   
   
   
   which looks to be the ideal solution for me.. i can feed front and backs from the master cylinder and fine tune the balance with the bias valve between the seats...
   
   trouble is.. where the feck does that master cylinder and ally plate come from??
   
   it looks to be a genuine pug/citroen part as its the std reservoir...
   
   anyone know if theres a similar setup on saxo kitcars? grpA?? S1600??
   
   
   cheers
   stu
2. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

   #2 9th May 2010, 22:04

   I personally wouldn't want to run without a servo if the car is on the road at all, even if 90% of driving is done on the track.
   
   That's the only thing that's put me off a pedal box............. although I do have a solution
3. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

   #3 9th May 2010, 22:06

   Metal plate looks custom - not sure about the mc, would imagine it's custom to going by how close the bulkhead part of the reservoir is to the servo bar/bracket
4. Aron Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Feb 2007 Nuneaton Posts: 3554 EP3 Civic

   #4 10th May 2010, 08:43

   i spoke to Jam about them before and it is a custom item. Give them a call and they will give you details.
   
   I dunnno Ross its not too bad without a servo if the brakes are set up correctly. Yes it is heavy but its a good compromise
5. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

   #5 10th May 2010, 17:42

   ahhh will have to try and contact them and see what the crack is...
   
   found a suitable tandem master cylinder on rallydesigns site:
   
   
   
   having said that the bore looks a touch big.. but theres always a way around these things...
6. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

   #6 10th May 2010, 17:49

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by Aron i spoke to Jam about them before and it is a custom item. Give them a call and they will give you details. I dunnno Ross its not too bad without a servo if the brakes are set up correctly. Yes it is heavy but its a good compromise

   When you mean setup correctly do you mean things like caliper piston diameters and mc diameter? Or more bias?
   
   It's something that I'd love to do as it makes it a lot easier to sort out a hydraulic clutch - but don't really want to risk it when the servo setup 'feels' fine? I can imagine being a bit disappointed having plumbed in a pedal box for the brakes and taking the car out ?
7. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

   #7 28th May 2010, 19:58

   tried contacting JAM and despite the classic "i`ll call you back" i`ve heard **** all... however i have done this:
   
   
   
   drawn up this:
   
   
   
   ordered an ally billet and in exchange for welding in some seat bars have arranged my mate Spanky to get it on the CNC mill......
   
   
   screw JAM lol...
8. user_16747 Banned Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 4328

   #8 28th May 2010, 20:24

   Alot of early metro ran with out a servo.
   And that was straight out the factory.
9. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

   #9 28th May 2010, 20:29

   There are many cars that run without servo's, and many of them far more menacing than a saxo
10. Simop Administrator Joined: Dec 2002 Warrington Posts: 20561 Blue Saxo VTS Turbo/White Megane F1 R26

    #10 1st June 2010, 00:14

    This is also something Ive been toying with a little lately, mainly as Ive often wondered what effect running boost may have on the operation of the diaphragm in the servo.
    
    I think as long as you get the master cylinder(s) piston diameter correct and can adjust front/rear bias, you can still have a great feeling pedal, without the use of a servo... or thats what Im hoping anyhow
    
    Simo
11. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

    #11 1st June 2010, 00:19

    It's the other way around simo. No servo will give you greater feel by far. It's just that your gonna need a much hencher foot to work 'em
12. Simop Administrator Joined: Dec 2002 Warrington Posts: 20561 Blue Saxo VTS Turbo/White Megane F1 R26

    #12 1st June 2010, 00:26

    Yeah, fair comment... maybe "great feeling pedal" was the wrong descriptor for what I meant lol
    
    As im using large multi-pot calipers, I think a change in the core of the brakes is worth exploring.
13. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

    #13 1st June 2010, 00:27

    And a lush billet racing pedal box for the list
14. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

    #14 22nd July 2010, 19:43

    JAMmotorsport can officially suck my testies!!!
    
    my mate Spanky knocked this up off my drawing...
    
    
    
    the first 4 bolts lined up a treat..
    
    
    
    as did the master cylinder...
    
    
    
    
    i wont be able to make anymore as this was a favour in return for weldng some seatbars into Spanks golf... but the drawngs there if you know a machinist...
15. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

    #15 22nd July 2010, 19:57

    Looks good - how do the brakes feel ?
16. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

    #16 22nd July 2010, 20:06

    god knows... theres no calipers on the other end of the pipes at the minute hahahahaha
17. Sparco_Tom Saxperience Addict Joined: Jan 2007 Aylesbury, Bucks Posts: 12836 Yeaaahh Fiesta

    #17 22nd July 2010, 20:06

    i Could be tempted to knock a few up if the price is right
18. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

    #18 22nd July 2010, 20:07

    loooool, so the brakes don't feel great at the moment
    
    you'll have to report back with how it feels !
19. slammed106 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 291

    #19 22nd July 2010, 20:12

    couldn`t tell you what JAM charge for theres as they never called me back or could give a price when i phoned them...
    
    as for the "missing" dimensions?? its up to you lot to work that out haha...
    
    
    brakes are a LONG way down the list of "to do`s" at the minute but will let ya know once its done...
20. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

    #20 22nd July 2010, 20:13

    Ross once you get reports of them feeling fine that's a great excuse to get a full obp adjustable pedal box

    1 user thanked this post: robster247
21. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

    #21 22nd July 2010, 20:19

    they're really cheap
    http://www2.obp.uk.net/catalog/produ...457adcd4068647
22. raunchz Saxperience Addict Joined: Jul 2005 Solihull / Bournemouth Posts: 14233 2015 Lapiz Blue Golf R

    #22 22nd July 2010, 20:22

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by adamskiTNR they're really cheap http://www2.obp.uk.net/catalog/produ...457adcd4068647

    looooool, you spending my money !?
    
    I did toy with the idea as need a hydraulic clutch pedal anyway - but I do like the feel of the servo setup and didn't want to spunk £500+ only to find the brakes being heavy and not to my liking.
    
    Will see how people think the un-servo'd setups feel
23. user_39821 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2009 Uckfield, East Sussex Posts: 3362 Citroen saxo 1.4 furio

    #23 22nd July 2010, 20:25

    Well i have no money to spend. And you were considering it so half way there

    1 user thanked this post: raunchz
24. user_15989 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: May 2007 Posts: 4857

    #24 22nd July 2010, 20:31

    Looks really well made but normally you dump the brake transfer bar if your dumping the servo. I way prefer the brakes with out a servo though I do tend to run huge brakes so no servo required.