rallye head on vtr help!

28th June 2010, 22:24

need a bit of help people, new to this site as i got a saxo the other day, its a mark 1 vtr blacktop. has a few problems at the moment which is the reason i only payed 500 quid for it. its done 83k not a scratch on it as in silver completely standard.

first problem was slipping clutch so i changed tht straight away and put a new one in, there was alot of oil on the inside of the gearbox and some slight play in the shaft, i took the fly wheel off and checked the crank seal and it looked ok so going to get a 1.1 gearbox and put tht on and see if it stops the clutch slipping.

just wundered if anyone has had any problems with putting the 1.1 gearbox in a vtr before i actually do it lol?

next thing is power steering pump i have twatted it with a hammer and it worked for a minute and then stopped working so think some crap has got inside and is causing a bad connection inside can they be taken apart and cleaned up?

also i have a s1 rallye head in my garage which i bought ages ago with a loom and ecu but sold the loom and ecu as i was short of cash. is it possible to use the standard vtr inlet on the head and the vtr loom and would it be driveable as i know the ports and valves are bigger and also there is a wilder cam, i believe i can use the same injectors and fuel pump, just wundered if i can simply just change the head like for like as i am going to change the head gasket anyway.

help would be appreciated guys cheers ross.

28th June 2010, 22:30

you can use the vtr loom and ecu, the injectors are different you will need rallye ones, the vtr inlet will fit it fine, the car might not run right though until its mapped

i used to have a 1.1 box on my vts and it was fine just dont boot it in first everytime as the diff is smaller so you will knacker it up, otherwise it'll be fine

and you might as well just buy a new pas pump tbh

28th June 2010, 22:33

The Rallye head is the same ( or very similar depending what year Rallye ) as the early VTR black top heads. The ports and valves are no different. So yes you can swap all the parts over.

28th June 2010, 22:34

so rallye injectors and a remap. gunna get a new pump i think mate just thought may save me abit of money. do the drive shafts fit fine then and everything as i know they are uprated compared to the 1.1 ones.

you have any idea of power after remap? and a rough cost?

28th June 2010, 22:38

if you take it to a good remapping centre they will do a rolling road so you will see a before and after gain and cost is around £200-300 for the remapping

28th June 2010, 22:45

ive heard that a rallye head combined with a rallye inlet and remap COULD see 120bhp but might be with a rallye ph2 cam (the ph3 equivilent of a vtr cam), i fitted a rallyehead/inlet to my vtr but i couldnt get it working properly though i think i timed it up wrong

28th June 2010, 22:46

ok mate cheers, would the cost cost of the remap and the rallye head b worth it for the money?

28th June 2010, 22:57

well i think you can just get the rallye head timed up properly then i should run ok, but obviously it wont have its full potential though but weather its worth it or not is another matter, if you got 120 with a ph2 cam and remap then yea id say its worth it as its an 8v it would probably have more torque than a 16v and it means you dont have to do an engine conversion, but you;ll have to decided weather its worth it or not obviously if you were trying to mod a furio/1.1 then id tell you its not worth it nut modifying a vtr is a bit more original

28th June 2010, 23:05

all vtrs use the same bottom end dont they ?

28th June 2010, 23:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by kc-saxo

all vtrs use the same bottom end dont they ?

Similar but no not really the same. Even one year VTR to another can have substantial changes.

28th June 2010, 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by AXracing

Similar but no not really the same. Even one year VTR to another can have substantial changes.

they can all use the rallye head though i thought ?

28th June 2010, 23:16

i have a rallye top end inc inlet and XSi 1.4 bottom end and i LOVE IT!!!!
very good torque mid-range for what it is and still rather peaky, needs a PROPER cam in though me thinks to make the most from it

29th June 2010, 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by AXracing

The Rallye head is the same ( or very similar depending what year Rallye ) as the early VTR black top heads. The ports and valves are no different. So yes you can swap all the parts over.

blacktop VTR has a small bearing cam, and the rallye has a big bearing cam. stamped 'J' on the end iirc.

29th June 2010, 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by PETE-VTR

blacktop VTR has a small bearing cam, and the rallye has a big bearing cam. stamped 'J' on the end iirc.

Thats a bit odd as all the blacktops I had where large bearing. Though thats not saying there are not small bearing ones as PSA did do a small bearing blacktop, so it may have made it in to the Saxo at some point. However saying that the large and small bearing heads still used the same valves and ports etc so there is no real point in changing one to another.

29th June 2010, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by AXracing

Thats a bit odd as all the blacktops I had where large bearing. Though thats not saying there are not small bearing ones as PSA did do a small bearing blacktop, so it may have made it in to the Saxo at some point. However saying that the large and small bearing heads still used the same valves and ports etc so there is no real point in changing one to another.

do you know what the measurements are for both sizes? thats thrown me after reading that, want to go check i have what i think i have...

29th June 2010, 21:14

Biggest end on the small bearing head is 42.5mm if I recall correctly.

Edit: Sorry now i think about it that may be the large bearing head. I dont tune these cars any more so dont have any to hand. Probably best to give Sandy a PM

30th June 2010, 15:21

all blacktop engines should have a large bearing cam.....
in particular the rallye has a J stamped on the end as previously stated and the XSi cam has a K stamped on the end of the cam.

hope that helps