NEWMAN PH4 Tarmac Rally Camshafts??

21st September 2010, 10:43

Spec..

VTS 1587cc 16V

Standerd apart from a fairly good 4 INTO 1 Full exhaust systems.

I've been working very hard to save for a nice set of cam's and a remap, so i've been looking around and saw these Newman PH4 Tarmac Rally Camshafts now with a good remaped will these be okay in my standerd VTS with just a 4into1 on her??

Thanks Guys.

21st September 2010, 10:56

No you would need Soild lifters and TB these are TOO wild mate get PH3 and remap would see you around 150-160bhp

21st September 2010, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

No you would need Soild lifters and TB these are TOO wild mate get PH3 and remap would see you around 150-160bhp

Thort they might be a bit to much.ha Thanks buddy, any idea where i can get some from??

Thanks

21st September 2010, 11:02

Are these the them....

Newman PH3 Fast Road Camshafts - Citroen Saxo VTS

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.php...-saxo-vts.html

21st September 2010, 11:15

Yep thats them or you could get catcams 708 which are on offer right now check kam racing or gmc and atspeed they have the offers on i know gmc is cheapest

21st September 2010, 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

Yep thats them or you could get catcams 708 which are on offer right now check kam racing or gmc and atspeed they have the offers on i know gmc is cheapest

Thanks buddy, which ones are better for more power 708 or Newman??

And should i do anything else while cams are being done like...Headgasket?? Cambelt?? things like that? i would like to do it in one hit.ha

Thanks mate, all the best

21st September 2010, 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

No you would need Soild lifters and TB these are TOO wild mate get PH3 and remap would see you around 150-160bhp

you dont NEED solid lifter or throttle bodies to run these cams. you do however need modified/forged pistons if you want to time them up properly.
throttle bodies would be ideal.

as said though, ph3's or 708's are much easier and a good fast road cam

21st September 2010, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

you dont NEED solid lifter or throttle bodies to run these cams. you do however need modified/forged pistons if you want to time them up properly.
throttle bodies would be ideal.

as said though, ph3's or 708's are much easier and a good fast road cam

"VOTE"

PH3's VS 708's???

Which are better??

21st September 2010, 11:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

you dont NEED solid lifter or throttle bodies to run these cams. you do however need modified/forged pistons if you want to time them up properly.
throttle bodies would be ideal.

as said though, ph3's or 708's are much easier and a good fast road cam

so what does it mean when they say you cant use these cams with standard injection or lifters on the website where you buy them from..

i think Kam or one of the other should put everyone in the right.

there aint much difference between 708's 0r ph3 but i have heard that you get a couple more HP out of Newmans ph3's

21st September 2010, 11:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pocoloco

"VOTE"

PH3's VS 708's???

Which are better??

very very similar but cat cams 708's have had a price drop so id say those.

21st September 2010, 11:31

Making an engine here with ph4 without solid lifters, using forged pistons and maybe rods+solid lifters aswell depending on the rev limit, yet to decide though.

21st September 2010, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

so what does it mean when they say you cant use these cams with standard injection or lifters on the website where you buy them from..

i think Kam or one of the other should put everyone in the right.

there aint much difference between 708's 0r ph3 but i have heard that you get a couple more HP out of Newmans ph3's

its on their reccomendation. it doesnt mean it cant be done. there has been a 106 gti with ph4's, pistons, breathing mods on STANDARD INLET that made 180'odd hp. so it can be done. and it states that you only need hydro lifters for ph4's.

21st September 2010, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

there aint much difference between 708's 0r ph3 but i have heard that you get a couple more HP out of Newmans ph3's

They're so similar that in reality the difference will only be made depending on the quality of the remap that you have and other components used.

There is really no point asking which is better out of the two.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

very very similar but cat cams 708's have had a price drop so id say those.

Agreed with Danny on this one. Its one of the rare occasions where you can happily buy whichever is cheaper.

21st September 2010, 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

its on their reccomendation. it doesnt mean it cant be done. there has been a 106 gti with ph4's, pistons, breathing mods on STANDARD INLET that made 180'odd hp. so it can be done. and it states that you only need hydro lifters for ph4's.

Toads old engine being a prime example. Still using hydraulics happily with the PH4's

21st September 2010, 11:45

To fit the Ph4's you are really going to need things like throttlebodies to pass emissions testing at the mot. Otherwise you are going to have to up the idle to stop it stalling at normal revs. Not necessarily a problem on a race or trackday car. I recommend it because I want people to be aware they are not buying something thats simply plug and play. They are also going to work better with a high compression piston to counter the compression drop from long duration camshafts. This is due to the valve overlap
As for Ph3 or Catcams, I dont think they are different enough to matter. The Newman is slightly wilder but its a smidgen of difference.
The catcams are going to fly out the door though now at the new price

Kev

21st September 2010, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

its on their reccomendation. it doesnt mean it cant be done. there has been a 106 gti with ph4's, pistons, breathing mods on STANDARD INLET that made 180'odd hp. so it can be done. and it states that you only need hydro lifters for ph4's.

I see your point but i dint wanna recommend the bloke a cam that would suit his set up that was all

Quote:

Originally Posted by KamRacing

To fit the Ph4's you are really going to need things like throttlebodies to pass emissions testing at the mot. Otherwise you are going to have to up the idle to stop it stalling at normal revs. Not necessarily a problem on a race or trackday car.
As for Ph3 or Catcams, I dont think they are different enough to matter. The Newman is slightly wilder but its a smidgen of difference

Kev

thanks Kam confirmed what i thought

21st September 2010, 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by nfs

I see your point but i dint wanna recommend the bloke a cam that would suit his set up that was all

thanks Kam confirmed what i thought

too true and a good point.

although, it does state its a race/rally cam so you cant expect it to have the emissions and the idle of a road cam. throttle bodies work wonders though.

21st September 2010, 13:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannygti

too true and a good point.

although, it does state its a race/rally cam so you cant expect it to have the emissions and the idle of a road cam. throttle bodies work wonders though.

Tbh all the effort to get a road legal cammed vts with say 170bhp is either alot of money and rather complicated. hence why im doing a fast road setup with the pred ecu and have nos jetted to give me 25bhp because then i will have the same amount if not more power but only when i want it. when people say get supercharger or turbo they dont look at the fact that some people dont want the power all the time i just jamming most of the time the a quick blast every now and then or on the track so nos is perfect for my sitution. ( thought i would get a few people asking why i chose nos)

21st September 2010, 15:07

Ph4 is a hydraulic profile cam, not a solid profile.

21st September 2010, 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin

Ph4 is a hydraulic profile cam, not a solid profile.

What is the change in the actual profile of the cam lobes between hydraulic and solid?
Just curious on the matter

21st September 2010, 15:18

Someone may correct me, but they dont have a certain amount of lift to warrant the shimmed up solid lifters, so an oil filled lifter is still sufficient to take up the gap between cam lobe and the lifter face.

I made a thread on it a good few months back about using a hydro profile on solid lifters.

Sandy: "The reason is that hydraulic lifters run zero clearance and except for the oil film are in contact with the cam lobe all the time. This means they don't need to be picked up by the cam "ramp", they will simply start opening straight away.
Solid lifters need a gentle ramp to take up the clearance and pick up the follower before the violent part of the opening can start."