Interesting VTR/VTS identification issues.

31st December 2010, 10:48

Right so I went down to pick up a new car yesterday. I went down thinking it was basically a 16v VTR, thinking it had just had an engine conversion at some point - since the Insurance sites among others had it down as a VTR on their systems, yet the photos showed the 16v engine.

So I had a look around it, and the thing has the Citroen Alarm (not sure if the VTR had this or not) VTS Passenger Airbag instead of the glovebox, Electric Wing Mirrors, ABS sensors and ABS, the VTS interior (which looks like it has never been removed) The different VTS clocks with the Oil Pressure guage iirc, and finally the 16v lump with the correct engine number on both the lump and the v5, all looking completely original and unmolested.

So basically I was just wondering if any of you old timers have ever seen anything like it? I'm convinced that it was factory built as a VTS but mistakenly registered as a VTR, I mean who is anal enough to change over the dash and wire in a new airbag, electric mirrors and the like when doing a VTS conversion?

Interested to know what you lot reckon.

31st December 2010, 10:49

Do you know where the car was first registered? As in England, Ireland etc.

31st December 2010, 10:50

Probably an import.

31st December 2010, 10:53

Where will it say if it's been imported? I take it you mean from ROI, as it's right-hand drive while most of Europe would be left-hand drive. So you think it's VTS spec but was registered as a VTR on entry to the UK? It's got VTS badges which again don't look like they've ever been removed.

31st December 2010, 10:56

Has it got a NI plate, ie ABC 8000
and HPI should say if its Imported.

31st December 2010, 10:58

sounds like an import, either way a cheap insureable vts for someone

31st December 2010, 11:12

I've got some weird pink sheet that is completely in French, all the documents from the start are all the same VIN number as when I got a text check and match the current V5 and the engine itself.

I've also got two handbooks, a replacement Citroen one in English and one saying Onderhoudsboekje van diensten en garanties, so I guess you're right, not sure where in Europe they drive on the right though.

It isn't really cheaper unless you don't declare the engine, as it's still registered as a VTR in the UK, which means if I crash and they see a 16v engine it will still void the insurance unless it's declared.

Oh and no NI plate, definately a UK plate.

It's not really a problem as I bought it mainly for parts anyway, but never seen anything like it!!

31st December 2010, 11:15

All the documents etc will match, they wont look at the engine and see its a 16v and start going doo-lally. The engine code will probs all match up. Its a standard car...whatever the insurance see it as is what it is.

31st December 2010, 11:21

Yeah right from registration I have documents saying the engine code is exactly what it is now. Question is do I declare it an import? I have no concrete evidence that it is an import, but is ignorance an excuse?

31st December 2010, 11:23

You dont know its an import! Insurance should know if it is. Just phone up for a quote or whatever as the oblivous car owner. If you wernt any wiser then you would think this is normal anyway

31st December 2010, 11:26

The VTS badges on the side are the only problem because even retarded people would have to be seriously special not to notice those say VTS and not VTR.

I'll ring up give them the registration and they'll probably say "It's a Citroen Saxo VTR is that correct?" At which point it gets complicated.

31st December 2010, 11:28

I want to put 1.1 badges on my vtr lol, its only a bit of writing, plenty of poeple badge up cars.

Just see what the insurance say, if we didnt say its possibly an import you wouldnt of known, or if you never owned a saxo and didnt know about cars, you wouldnt think anything is dodgy.

31st December 2010, 11:29

stick the VIN into servicebox

IIRC the engine code is part of the vin too.

31st December 2010, 11:36

Yeah it's got the NFX code in there, so it's definately a VTS lump on the logbook, right back from registration.

31st December 2010, 11:36

Is this car silver and name dan H*ar*e
on topic,
see if the date of manufacture is significantly different to date of registration would suggest being an import, do a proper HPI check like the £3,99 ones comes up a bit more detailed.

31st December 2010, 11:41

Yeah that's right mate, how come?

31st December 2010, 11:44

soz trying to relate FB with sax-p is challenging lol... if your not satisfied with it i will buy it off you for £0.20 and a bag of chippys

31st December 2010, 11:52

Think I'll pass you up on that one buddy,

yeah think I've got you on FB, are you Chris's mate?

31st December 2010, 21:07

Not being funny but why would you care if your buying it for parts?? it makes no odds what so ever.

1st January 2011, 14:55

Another small update on the identification issues (for those that care of course)

After speaking to a very helpful person in the DVLA (shock!) it would appear this is a common problem, especially with the 3 Door/5 Door thing.

Because the cars details are registered by the salesman in his office it is subject to human error. After I explained that the VIN number actually has the NFX code in it, which indicates it is definately a VTS (or the same spec as a UK VTS at least) he said all I need to do is get a confirmation email or note from Citroen indicating the NFX code is tied to the VTS and only the VTS, and to also confirm they never made a 5 door version, send it in with a photograph of the VIN number on the car matching the one on the logbook, the logbook itself and a short cover note and they will amend it and send it straight back.

I know some of you may not agree and think it's a missed opportunity to get cheaper Insurance etc, but I'd much rather everything was kosher and above board. Since I can't confirm or deny it being an import for sure I haven't mentioned it in there.