MK1 to MK2 Gap

  1. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #1
    orite i have a year 2000 saxo vtr
    its the MK2 body
    and the Mk2 Driveshafts and Gearbox
    And the Mk2 Inlet manifold and rocker cover

    Yet its a Single Plug ECU

    whats the script with the gap year saxos?

    are they the 98bhp ones or the 93bhp ones
    as if it has the mk2 top end and inlet i would have thought it would be the 98bhp model as the differences are in the top end....

    what use recon?
  2. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #2
    So it has the MK1 ECU and Radiator and interior aswell as a non- key pad immobiliser
  3. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #3
    anyone?
  4. Super Moderator Joined: Aug 2007 Lancashire Posts: 14256 Astra VXR + 1989 Astra GTE
    #4
    90bhp, not that it really matters

    You wont see a noticeable difference between the 90 and 98bhp models.
  5. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #5
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    90bhp, not that it really matters

    You wont see a noticeable difference between the 90 and 98bhp models.
    +1 its the 90 hp

    there was a transitional phase where some W reg cars were Single plug, Mk1 loom etc but still a mk2 then later ones were Single plug with mk2 loom then the Y reg started the tripple plug and mk2 loom.
  6. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #6
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    90bhp, not that it really matters

    You wont see a noticeable difference between the 90 and 98bhp models.
    well if its the mk2 engine with the mk1 loom then it does matter as its a 8bhp difference lol
  7. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #7
    when i say loom i meant ecu ^^^^
  8. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #8
    The engines are exactly the same iirc the only difference is the ECU what gets the extra performance is the Map on the ecu, i am assuming here but that would seem logical for shitroen.
  9. Super Moderator Joined: Aug 2007 Lancashire Posts: 14256 Astra VXR + 1989 Astra GTE
    #9
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SaxSpeed View Post
    well if its the mk2 engine with the mk1 loom then it does matter as its a 8bhp difference lol
    No it doesnt
  10. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #10
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jordysport View Post
    The engines are exactly the same iirc the only difference is the ECU what gets the extra performance is the Map on the ecu, i am assuming here but that would seem logical for shitroen.
    pretty sure the differences are in the top end actuly lol
  11. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #11
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    No it doesnt
    well when you performance enhance an engine every little matters and 8bhp is almost 10% of the engine power
  12. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #12
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SaxSpeed View Post
    pretty sure the differences are in the top end actuly lol
    Ok then, if it makes you feel better and deny everything everyone says yours is the 98bhp version as paul said its bugger all difference.

    EDIT: it makes every difference in Motorsport yes but you wouldn't be using an R engine in the first place. your just gonna be driving to and from and maybe a blat on the back roads.
  13. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #13
    yes i know this but that is still a difference and you would notice 8 odd % less power

    thats about the same difference as cams on a vts so yes it is a difference that matters lol
  14. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #14
    Ok let me put it another way, what are you going to do if you have the 90 hp model? are you gonna change the whole head inlet etc (if it is the Head/inlet which i doubt it is) ?

    I would think that citroen would use the same engine but a different map, or minor components so that they don't have to fork out of Very very very expensive moulds for the engine.
  15. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #15
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jordysport View Post
    Ok let me put it another way, what are you going to do if you have the 90 hp model? are you gonna change the whole head inlet etc (if it is the Head/inlet which i doubt it is) ?

    I would think that citroen would use the same engine but a different map, or minor components so that they don't have to fork out of Very very very expensive moulds for the engine.
    the difference is not the ecu i can tell you that, and they run different specs off cams im almost positive they do.

    and no i wouldnt swap itt but it would help to know what model the block is
  16. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #16
    Ok maybe it is slightly better profiled cams and a better inlet and a map. but its a 90 hp fact, to have the better TB and cams if there are such, you would need to have the better map that went with it, which would be the triple plug ecu. so if you have Single plug ecu = 90hp 3 plug ecu 98hp .. as a general rule of thumb.
  17. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #17
    ok, so we have established the combination of the ecu and cam type is the difference beetween the mk1 and 2
  18. Established Member Joined: Aug 2009 Colchester/Harwich, Essex Posts: 2208 EG Civic Turbo & CRX Del Sol VTi
    #18
    It really isn't much difference even though the figures say otherwise.

    My 98 VTR used to hump my mates 02 VTR, near enough standard for standard. Only logical reason was that I had the healthier engine.
  19. Super Moderator Joined: Aug 2007 Lancashire Posts: 14256 Astra VXR + 1989 Astra GTE
    #19
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SaxSpeed View Post
    well when you performance enhance an engine every little matters and 8bhp is almost 10% of the engine power
    Performance enhance an engine? - Makes it sound its a 500bhp cosworth you're working on not a 90bhp saxo lol.

    It all depends whether you get hung up on bhp figures over reality.

    Your is definately the 90bhp model.

    In terms of performance and in the real world (not on a forum or in the pub talking about bhp figures), if you go up against 98bhp model on a 1/4mile or track it will make no difference. It will go down to whos the better driver, who gets grip first, which engine has been serviced and looked after most, tyres etc.

    8bhp is nothing. Especially when your talking 90bhp vs 98bhp. Every engine is different, every rolling road is different.

    For example i've taken my 106 on rolling roads and had different figures everytime, once 145bhp, once 153bhp once 157bhp and once 163bhp. What i'm basically saying is dont get hung up on exact bhp figures, with saxos they're good to give you an idea of how powerful it is and what sort of mods it has. Thats it, you cant say one car is faster than another because it allegably has 8bhp more.

    I've had about 6 or 7 VTRs, mostly 98bhp models (3 plug Y reg onwards) but a few 90bhp models. In the real world i could not tell any difference.
  20. Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 East Devon Posts: 7472 Clio RS200 Cup, Twingo RS133, Triumph Street Tripl
    #20
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SaxSpeed View Post
    ok, so we have established the combination of the ecu and cam type is the difference beetween the mk1 and 2
    No that has not been established i am just taking your word on it, as i have had no reason to faf about with the extra 8hp, just put a VTS in. from searching on other threads it would appear to get the 8hp its ECU, cam profile, and TB.
  21. Established Member Joined: Mar 2010 Cupar Fife Posts: 1712 1600 16v VTS 1600 8v VTR 1400 16v Clio Sport
    #21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jordysport View Post
    No that has not been established i am just taking your word on it, as i have had no reason to faf about with the extra 8hp, just put a VTS in. from searching on other threads it would appear to get the 8hp its ECU, cam profile, and TB.
    probs goin to vts this vtr aswell anyway lol