work this out-----16v running issues

1. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

   #1 22nd February 2011, 18:06

   2001 (3 plug) 16v
   has second lamda fault (its missing but has been for about 6 months)
   
   car runs ok when cold no issues at all when its warm its fine too apart from not revving past 3750 rpm
   
   Everything else is fine
   Its had recently
   New front lamda
   New crank sensor
   New map sensor
   And the inlet stripped and cleaned and re sealed
   
   Any ideas on whats gone on??
2. Sophia_Bush Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Jan 2007 Shropshire Posts: 9994 Moonstone Blue 106 GTi

   #2 22nd February 2011, 18:14

   either the tps is doing some weird shit or iirc 3 plug ecus don't they have a tendancy of shitting themselves?
3. blackie_2k5 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2008 Birtley Posts: 22253 VTR Turbo, 106 xsi track slag, Transit recovery, B

   #3 22nd February 2011, 18:41

   was it a converted car? as most seem to have issues ith unlocked or converted 3 plug ecu's these days.....
4. vtr_chris90 Established Member Joined: Jun 2008 nuneaton Posts: 1796 LY R26

   #4 22nd February 2011, 18:48

   Im sure Alex wont mind me answering lol
   
   
   

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by Sophia_Bush either the tps is doing some weird shit or iirc 3 plug ecus don't they have a tendancy of shitting themselves?

   They do sometimes, but I'm sure alex has already tried swappin the Ecu to try that as he asked me to do diagnostics afterwards, but if the Ecu has died It doesn't always allow you to do diagnostics, well mine never anyway an mine was single plug too lol. It kept kickin me out of the system
   
   

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by blackie_2k5 was it a converted car? as most seem to have issues ith unlocked or converted 3 plug ecu's these days.....

   The car is a 51 plate so is a standard 3plug and as alex said diagnostics keep showing as clear
   
   
   Oh just a thought alex, have you tried the fuel relay under Ecu? Mine caused me loads of hassle if you remember as we thought it was the lambda or crank sensor at first.
5. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

   #5 22nd February 2011, 20:12

   Its not converted but ecu is unlocked
   
   Chris that relay tend to lead to it just cutting out on 3 pluggers like leas did
   im really baffled and now pissed off with it tbh
6. pjm300 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Jun 2005 Potters Bar United Kingdom (England) Posts: 2749 T/B'd VTS

   #6 22nd February 2011, 20:21

   has your backbox shat itself? my poor old ka (bless its cotton socks) couldnt rev past 2k due to a fucked backbox
7. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

   #7 22nd February 2011, 20:44

   I dont think theres a blockage in the exhsust gas is coming out as normally does can feel the pressure from it
   
   Its less than 6 months old aswell still
8. user_15516 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 6640 Integra DC5R & VTS

   #8 22nd February 2011, 20:46

   Probably a long shot, but new plugs and fuel filter might be worth a try.
   
   Someone I know had similar problems and it turned out the ECU was at fault.
9. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

   #9 22nd February 2011, 21:05

   Thinking it could be ecu tbh
10. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #10 23rd February 2011, 08:28

    Edited first post as i forgot some info lol
    
    Todays mission
    New fuel filter
    New plugs
    New coilpack
    And im going to try no airbox incase thats blocked somehow
11. jpsaxo Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Oct 2005 Sydney Posts: 8525 Mango Westcoast

    #11 23rd February 2011, 08:31

    sounds like a typical 3 plug gayness
    
    But try what plum said as well just disconnect at the manifold/exhaust and see what happens mate
12. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #12 23rd February 2011, 08:39

    Id be deaf is what would happen waiting for it to warm up then trying to rev past 4k with just a btb wont be quiet lol
13. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #13 23rd February 2011, 11:27

    Got a few pics to upload prety sure its not an electrical problem the cylenders are full of oil all 4 spark plugs are coated and the coilpack is on cylender 4 where oils got past the plug
14. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #14 23rd February 2011, 11:46

    all 4 plugs look like this...
    
    
15. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #15 23rd February 2011, 12:08

    so the tips came out caped in oil?
16. user_9396 Established Member Joined: Apr 2006 torquay (England) Posts: 1993 supercharged vts. 1.1 saxo. accord type r

    #16 23rd February 2011, 12:08

    Head gasket?or leaking from the covers getting in somehow.
    No sign of this oil when running?
17. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #17 23rd February 2011, 12:35

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by adsayer so the tips came out caped in oil?

    exactly how it came out is how you see it even the coilpack is full of it which i really dont understand
    
    

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by adzvtr Head gasket?or leaking from the covers getting in somehow. No sign of this oil when running?

    thinking piston rings its done 120k now and head was rebuilt at 90 i have recipts for allsorts including 16 new valves
18. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #18 23rd February 2011, 13:06

    and oil around the coil pack or in the coil pack (the long rubber bits)? man that's weird.
    
    Check the dipstick, run the engine for a bit and have a look around the cam ladders and the coilpack for any leakage. Check the colour of the exhaust smoke, any bluish and you're burning oil.
19. user_9396 Established Member Joined: Apr 2006 torquay (England) Posts: 1993 supercharged vts. 1.1 saxo. accord type r

    #19 23rd February 2011, 14:06

    If rings are gone. Ur oil pressure will be high. How bad was the oil in the intake.
    When my rings had gone i was filling an oil catch tank within 5 mins.
    Could be the cause making it find a way out by the coil pack.
20. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #20 23rd February 2011, 16:15

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by adsayer and oil around the coil pack or in the coil pack (the long rubber bits)? man that's weird. Check the dipstick, run the engine for a bit and have a look around the cam ladders and the coilpack for any leakage. Check the colour of the exhaust smoke, any bluish and you're burning oil.

    It smokes white on starts but that clears no leaking from ladders there all still clean it had a head rebuild 30k ago
    
    

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by adzvtr If rings are gone. Ur oil pressure will be high. How bad was the oil in the intake. When my rings had gone i was filling an oil catch tank within 5 mins. Could be the cause making it find a way out by the coil pack.

    mine does breath but not to extremes probably a few mm in my catch tank after a week or so
    
    Very confused tbh
21. ryanmt Established Member Joined: Oct 2004 Warrington Posts: 1987 AX VTS 57 3.0 TDI A5

    #21 23rd February 2011, 17:36

    when you say it doesn't rev how do you mean, does it missfire/backfire.. or just not pickup etc?
    
    The oil around the coilpack is more often than not leaking cam cover seals, not related to this issue.
    
    I know this is a long shot but.. do you have access to an oscilloscope?
22. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #22 23rd February 2011, 22:17

    Cam covers arent leaking ill show a video of it revving
    
    
    
    But the actual cylenders are oily if you shine a torch inside
23. user_15516 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 6640 Integra DC5R & VTS

    #23 23rd February 2011, 22:23

    So the cam covers, ladders etc. are all sealed? Is there any way they could be leaking into the spark plug holes?
    
    I've seen a coil pack and plugs with that much oil on before, a leaky cam cover was to blame. The engine ran fine, strangely.
24. ryanmt Established Member Joined: Oct 2004 Warrington Posts: 1987 AX VTS 57 3.0 TDI A5

    #24 23rd February 2011, 22:25

    I had a vauxhall omega for a bit, that used to leak from the cam covers too. The sparkplugs were fully submerged in oil . Still ran alright though
25. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #25 23rd February 2011, 22:41

    how many times
    
    THE CAM COVERS/LADDERS DO NOT LEAK
    
    Dont matter anyway now as i may have purchased something to solve the issue in the way of a jp4
26. ryanmt Established Member Joined: Oct 2004 Warrington Posts: 1987 AX VTS 57 3.0 TDI A5

    #26 23rd February 2011, 22:44

    I never said they did, I was just commenting that it can still work fine even if there is oil on the outside of the plugs.
    
    It sounds electrical to me anyway so im not sure if an jp4 will fix it. Cant harm in trying it though
27. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #27 23rd February 2011, 22:46

    Im thinking its blow by on the rings and letting oil up personally ill get a compression tester on it but im thinking jp4 i havent actually bought it yet though
28. ryanmt Established Member Joined: Oct 2004 Warrington Posts: 1987 AX VTS 57 3.0 TDI A5

    #28 24th February 2011, 00:09

    Could be, i would expect alot of crank case pressure if that was the case though?
29. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #29 24th February 2011, 07:03

    Id have thought that too its an odd one but as said it doesnt matter anymore lol
    This engine has been a bit tempremental for the last few months and then this i was thinking getting a low mileage engine just to bide me over till i have funds for my 180bhp build so ill just do that
30. user_35014 Established Member Joined: Jun 2009 Helensburgh Posts: 1206 Cammed Ph2 VTS

    #30 24th February 2011, 10:30

    You have checked that the butterfly is opening fully havent you..
31. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #31 24th February 2011, 13:11

    Ill ignore that
32. Mochachino Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Nov 2007 Guantanamo Bay Posts: 28700 oyster card

    #32 24th February 2011, 13:39

    have you checked the cam covers aint leaking Alex?
33. willsy West Midlands Joined: Nov 2005 Nuneaton (West Mids) Posts: 13835 '64 Volvo V40 R’Design, '89 Ph1 309 GTi, ‘97 Mk1 S

    #33 24th February 2011, 13:58

    Hmmm you did have an epic cam cover leak a while didnt you, however any remains that weren't mopped up at the time would only be on the top of the plugs.
    
    From the pic though as Alex suspects its clear that the threaded bits covered in oil aswel, oil wouldnt have got past the seals to have covered the thread so its gotta be an internal issue to have covered the threads too.
    
    JP4's are shit, a rebuild of the existing engine probably wont be much more expensive (depending where you have it done) than it would to buy an uber low milage JP4 and at least you know the condition of it then will be spot on for the better things to come when theyre fitted
34. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #34 24th February 2011, 14:45

    I know the jp4 im lookingto buy matt and the leak before was the breather as my cam cover was missing a baffle i cleaned it all up when i did the thermostat housing the other week
35. willsy West Midlands Joined: Nov 2005 Nuneaton (West Mids) Posts: 13835 '64 Volvo V40 R’Design, '89 Ph1 309 GTi, ‘97 Mk1 S

    #35 24th February 2011, 15:26

    Ive just stumbled upon a post made by someone else that may suggest where you're going with this (you crafty git)
    
    In which case you can be forgiven, I shall edit my opinion accordingly in that standard JP4's are shit
    
    I dare say you'll confirm later this evening when you're at the raj
36. AlexBp West Midlands Joined: Dec 2007 West mids Posts: 23149 Supra,civic GL

    #36 24th February 2011, 17:26

    I have no idea what your on about matthew
37. FinchysSaxo Established Member Joined: Dec 2006 Buckinghamshire Posts: 2087 Megane F1 R26 Liquid Yellow

    #37 24th February 2011, 18:13

    Something stuck underneath the accelerator pedal?
38. blackie_2k5 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2008 Birtley Posts: 22253 VTR Turbo, 106 xsi track slag, Transit recovery, B

    #38 27th February 2011, 00:58

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by FinchysSaxo Something stuck underneath the accelerator pedal?

    made me lol