Trailing arm coming off rear axle

1. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

   #1 2nd May 2011, 16:52

   hi all,
   
   today i decided to lower the rear of my saxo. all went well untill i came to removing the torsion bar, i tried the socket and bolt method and snapped two bolts, i then used the slide hammer and still did not manage to free the torsion bar from the trailing arm. it was then that i noticed the trailing arm coming off the axle i have hit it back on with a mallet will it be okay or is my beam f**ked??
   
   Many thanks
2. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

   #2 2nd May 2011, 16:54

   If the beam was already nackered then the bearings may fall out of the trailing arm. Have you removed the ARB and the washe on the side of the torsion bar which is coming off along with the trailing arm?
3. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

   #3 2nd May 2011, 16:56

   No i didn't remove the ARB but i did remove the washer it took a fair bit of digging out tbh. i was following this guide http://www.suzukituning.com/PSA/Suspension/Lowering.htm
4. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

   #4 2nd May 2011, 17:02

   You have to remove the washer for the torsion bar to come out or you cannot lower your beam. It will be because the washer is still there that the trailing arm has come off too.
   
   If you havnt undone the ARB whatsoever then how has the trailing arm come off the pin? The ARB keeps the two trailing arms together.
5. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

   #5 2nd May 2011, 17:06

   sorry i have removed the washer, but not the ARB. the whole trailing arm came around 10-20mm from the bearing seal ?
6. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

   #6 2nd May 2011, 17:09

   Just use a bar and a hammer on the torsion bar. So the bearing seal has come away from the trailing arm?
   
   Leave the ARB tightened on the beam. Hit the torsion bars out on both sides then undo the arb to allow the trailing arms to spin round to where you want and then refit the torsion bars and then the ARB.
   
   You cannot damagae a beam from the trailing arm coming off. But you can reveal an already damaged beam by hitting the trailing arm off.
7. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

   #7 2nd May 2011, 17:14

   sorry i don't quite understand you. so if the trailing arm comes of the beam completely, this is okay ? even though i haven't touched the ARB ?
8. user_36198 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2009 ilkeston derbyshire Posts: 9823 C2 VTR stripped, 406hdi, clio 172

   #8 2nd May 2011, 17:19

   fail to see how the arm has come off without you touching the ARB, unless this has seperated inside the tube.

   1 user thanked this post: Kyza
9. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

   #9 2nd May 2011, 17:20

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by mandyslover70 fail to see how the arm has come off without you touching the ARB, unless this has seperated inside the tube.

   is this bad ?
10. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

    #10 2nd May 2011, 17:22

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NobbyClarke sorry i don't quite understand you. so if the trailing arm comes of the beam completely, this is okay ? even though i haven't touched the ARB ?

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mandyslover70 fail to see how the arm has come off without you touching the ARB, unless this has seperated inside the tube.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NobbyClarke is this bad ?

    Only thing I can assume is the end plate has come off the ARB? Which is nothing to worry about as theyre designed to, just not usually that easily.
11. user_36198 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2009 ilkeston derbyshire Posts: 9823 C2 VTR stripped, 406hdi, clio 172

    #11 2nd May 2011, 17:22

    not really but you're going to end up having to take the ARB out to realign it. Unless,as yours is a 1.1,it has no ARB, i never thought of that!!

    1 user thanked this post: NobbyClarke
12. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

    #12 2nd May 2011, 17:23

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mandyslover70 not really but you're going to end up having to take the ARB out to realign it. Unless,as yours is a 1.1,it has no ARB, i never thought of that!!

    Or that lol. Think its usually the older S1 106's though? correct me if im wrong.
13. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

    #13 2nd May 2011, 17:27

    ahh mine is a 1.1i x 1997 lmao so i dont have an ARB? so when pulling on the torsion bar the trailing arm coming off is okay ?
14. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

    #14 2nd May 2011, 17:31

    Its not a bad thing unless your beam is already nackered before you started playing around with it. If it was already nakered and the trailing arm comes off then you risk the needle pin bearings falling out of their race. If this happens then fully remove your trailing arm and fit new bearings if the pin is ok. (If you lower your beam and the beam was nackered then you will need to dismantle it at some point to replace the bearings nd probably the pins too).
    
    If the trailing arm comes off and the pins dont fall out then refit it with some grease on the bearings.
    
    Ideally you dont want the trailing arm to come off, but sometimes you have no choice, it just comes off.
15. Kyza Established Member Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 1016

    #15 2nd May 2011, 17:34

    In other words, dont worry about the trailing arm coming off. If it comes off and the bearings are fine then all good. If they fall out then its best you find out now anyway rather than later and you should either have new bearings or the beam refurbished. It wont be any fault of your own if the bearings fall out etc.
16. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

    #16 2nd May 2011, 17:38

    okay, many thanks to you all. i have put it all back together now. so i will try to lower it again at a later date. so pissed off now that i know i should have just kept going. but tbh the torsion bar wasnt budging, it was coming out of the fixed spines
17. willsy West Midlands Joined: Nov 2005 Nuneaton (West Mids) Posts: 13835 '64 Volvo V40 R’Design, '89 Ph1 309 GTi, ‘97 Mk1 S

    #17 2nd May 2011, 18:39

    If you have ARB end plates that are secured by a 13mm headed bolt then you will have an ARB. 1.0 and 1.1 typically has the smaller ARB at the rear. The smallest one listed on service box is 15mm, but even for 1.0 models an 18mm arb is listed
    
    Early AX's and Early 106's of the very very basic spec came without a rear ARB and had an end cap slotted in at the end of the trailing arms to seal it.
18. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

    #18 2nd May 2011, 19:23

    Hmm i do have the 13mm sockets on the end plates. so do you think my ARB has come of from inside the housing ?
19. user_19702 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2007 Kendal, Cumbria Posts: 2728 White mk1 VTS

    #19 3rd May 2011, 01:35

    heres what id do....
    
    > Get a ratchet strap and put it from one arm to the other (stopping the arms moving apart)
    
    > Put a socket over one end with a bolt though (to keep tension)
    
    > Then get a shorter bolt and screw it in the other end of the torision bar (so it sits flush tot he end of the bar)
    
    > Get an old bar or i used a 1/2inch ratchet extension and his the bolt and i mean hit it, and 'push' the bar out instead of pulling it.
    
    youll notice if its comming loose as the bolt on the socket will come loose, so just keep tightening it up as you so
    
    If you dont have the bolt in then end your hitting you risk damaging your torsion bar...no idea is this is of any help, but worth a shot lol
20. user_10418 Saxperience Addict Joined: Jun 2006 Wirral Posts: 13584 Wickerd red VTS MK2, Two tone VTS MK2,vvc Metro..

    #20 3rd May 2011, 02:43

    I use brass drift for knocking out torsion bars!! works treat with out damagen the ends of the torsion bar threads.........
21. NobbyClarke Regular Poster Joined: Jun 2009 Coventry Posts: 438 Citroen Saxo X 1.1i

    #21 3rd May 2011, 13:01

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Goldsax heres what id do.... > Get a ratchet strap and put it from one arm to the other (stopping the arms moving apart) > Put a socket over one end with a bolt though (to keep tension) > Then get a shorter bolt and screw it in the other end of the torision bar (so it sits flush tot he end of the bar) > Get an old bar or i used a 1/2inch ratchet extension and his the bolt and i mean hit it, and 'push' the bar out instead of pulling it. youll notice if its comming loose as the bolt on the socket will come loose, so just keep tightening it up as you so If you dont have the bolt in then end your hitting you risk damaging your torsion bar...no idea is this is of any help, but worth a shot lol

    Ok thanks i will give this a go maybe next weekend, as i am fed up of it at the moment lmao.
    
    One day it will be low
22. willsy West Midlands Joined: Nov 2005 Nuneaton (West Mids) Posts: 13835 '64 Volvo V40 R’Design, '89 Ph1 309 GTi, ‘97 Mk1 S

    #22 3rd May 2011, 14:26

    Where abouts in Coventry are you based out of interest? (Postcode)
    
    I do lowering in Nuneaton if you'd like it doing.
    
    If you're determined to have another go yourself though and have got to the stage where all the 4 torsion bar end bolts are out and the 4 washers and you're literally just needing the bars out, I don't normally travel but if you're not too far away ill come and knock them out for you for a small fee.