internal braided lines

11th June 2013, 08:56

Is this everything i need? and a good price?

full set of brake lines for the front and rear, fronts have been dry fitted rears still need some making up for your car.
willwood bias valve
speedflow fittings
speedflow banjos
goodrich lines
goodrich t peices
£200

Thanks James

11th June 2013, 09:25

I sold mine with torques fittings at 160 posted
And mine were made up already.

11th June 2013, 09:29

ok thanks for that

is there everything their that i need?

11th June 2013, 09:37

Looks like its for a four port mc setup?

Carnt tell size wise but looks about right from memory dude.
Has it been mocked it up previously?

11th June 2013, 09:52

That is all i got from the description, it's for sale on 106RR my car currently has abs and i need rid not entirely sure what else needs doing ? :/

11th June 2013, 10:15

You will need a four port master cylinder.

Then just get rid of all your abs bits and bobs
Then run these lines to your four port mc

Then you can upgrade to a four port 23mm master cylinder

( I can sell you one)?

Or you can just use copper lines on any mc

11th June 2013, 10:33

Id ask the seller 2 or 4 port
I count 6 bqnjos so to that says 2 banjos off the mc and one to each caliper

11th June 2013, 10:34

Pretty sure i have a 23mm master cylinder already, not sure how many ports though. Will get back to you! Thanks

11th June 2013, 10:49

This looks like a 2 port set up, the two T-Pieces are the give away. (Two off the Master Cylinder = 4 to the Calipers)

Pretty good price, I bought a half complete Speedflow kit and spent a fair bit getting all the right fittings for the calipers.

I have had them for over a year now and had no problems. This is a similar set up to mine, alloy ends in the car and stainless under so no corrosion. Some people say not to use the alloy fittings for brake lines but that's rubbish, here's an email I had from Speedflow.

Quote:

I can assure you they are completely safe to use on a braking system – it is what they are designed for.

The main reason people choose the ali ends are if they like the colour or if their requirement is for a light weight version – this is normally adopted by the racing bikes when every extra ounce in weight to them seems to deprive them of some horse power!

Please do not hesitate to contact me again if you have any further questions.

Regards

Fay Fischer

11th June 2013, 11:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by qrty

This looks like a 2 port set up, the two T-Pieces are the give away. (Two off the Master Cylinder = 4 to the Calipers)

Pretty good price, I bought a half complete Speedflow kit and spent a fair bit getting all the right fittings for the calipers.

I have had them for over a year now and had no problems. This is a similar set up to mine, alloy ends in the car and stainless under so no corrosion. Some people say not to use the alloy fittings for brake lines but that's rubbish, here's an email I had from Speedflow.

HEL Performance Brakes *strongly* disagree:

Quote:

Never Use Aluminum Fittings On Braking Systems

http://www.helusa.com/info/aluminum-fittings.html

I remember a discussion on this a few years ago.

11th June 2013, 11:12

my question would be why are you fitting complete braided lnes in the first place
is it a precieved up grade or just bling?
you could re pipe the complete car with copper for about £30 + price of tee piece to join the rear lines .
there is no technical advantage of braided over solid piping + with care you can get a neater job with solid pipe which takes up less space as well.
same goes for braided fuel lines --solid copper front to back is every bit as good and can takes less space as well as being a lot cheaper.
1 roll of 8 or 10mm copper pipe £20?,then flexible fuel hose ( as fitted by car makers)and good quality fuel hose clips will comply with all regs
but if its "bling " you want then go braided

11th June 2013, 11:18

Not bling at all, i have only ever modified with "bolt ons" i just want to get the job done, will give that kit a miss then, is it best to run copper pipes inside or out? once the bias valve has been set i am unlikely to change it again...

11th June 2013, 11:20

I totally agree with ross once you add mositure to the equation you will get electrolysis over time .
yet another reason to keep to what the car maker uses for std cars apart from the cost .
to be fair the corrosion will not happen very quickly ,but it will happen .
I had to change the dry sump lines on a ferrari 458 last year for same reason --s/s braided fitted to alloy fittings --the corrosion on the alloy fitting expanded so much under the swaged fittings it burst the alloy clamping band on the outside of the s/s briaded hose .
the car is 20 years old ,but even then at nearly £2000 for 4 ferrari pipes man was not happy

11th June 2013, 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy-Boy

Not bling at all, i have only ever modified with "bolt ons" i just want to get the job done, will give that kit a miss then, is it best to run copper pipes inside or out? once the bias valve has been set i am unlikely to change it again...

I was fully braided, and have gone back to copper throughout (except for the flex parts obviously!). Much neater, and technically both stronger and better. You can run a bias valve with copper no problem just plumb it in as you were thinking for the braided. But what's the requirement for the bias valve if you don't mind me asking?

11th June 2013, 11:28

run pipes inside car and inside any roll cage mountings ,so they cannot get trapped in the event of a big shunt .
run the rear line up the tunnel and mount bias at side of h/brake lever for ease of adjustment .
to get best from bias you would normally adjust it to suit the grip available on your warm up laps
it won,t change much but it will alter day to day when on the limit
rears should lock microscopically before the fronts ,so you can actually turn in under braking ,if needed ,and drift the rear end to point the front where you want it --
even more important if you are a left foot brake man ,then you can still keep the power on at same time .
takes lots of practise to get that bit right -- not something I reccomend for the faint hearted though

11th June 2013, 11:29

What ive done is run saxo/106 base model front lines so 1.1 1.4 vtr basically any with non abs

The blocked a port on the mc and ran a single braided line through the car to the rear so it looks pretty in the footwell (mine doesnt run up over the rear bench area) all in full stainless in teflon coated stuff

11th June 2013, 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross

HEL Performance Brakes *strongly* disagree:

http://www.helusa.com/info/aluminum-fittings.html

I remember a discussion on this a few years ago.

Read a few things on this too and I vaguely remember a few discussions.

I understand what they are saying about corrosion which is why I have only used alloy fittings within the car (dry environment). For the reaction to happen an electrolyte must be present, water/salt water would act as such (process would be dramatically sped up if totally immersed). However in a rural atmosphere the risk of the reaction is low (in the car).

I know braking is not something to overlook which is why I always check my lines for any sign of damage, corrosion or leaks. (Honestly I do check)

Stuff like this generally interests me

Not looking to start any arguments just writing on what I've read, been advised and how mine are.

11th June 2013, 12:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by qrty

Stuff like this generally interests me

Not looking to start any arguments just writing on what I've read, been advised and how mine are.

Yeah me too - that's why I was interested when the discussion came about last time lol. Genuine interest.

John's example is a good one, but with a dry sump system being exposed externally I can see it's open to abuse. I wonder if the mere moisture in the air is enough to corrode lines in the car?

11th June 2013, 12:50

rover zr /45 use alloy washers on rear caliper banjo bolt onto the steel caliper and they are always corroded to hell if you have to remove the flex pipe,and nearly always leak on refitment if you don,t replace them

11th June 2013, 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross

John's example is a good one, but with a dry sump system being exposed externally I can see it's open to abuse. I wonder if the mere moisture in the air is enough to corrode lines in the car?

From what I've read corrosion in open air but covered (rural atmosphere) would be quite low if it occurs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by axsaxoman

rover zr /45 use alloy washers on rear caliper banjo bolt onto the steel caliper and they are always corroded to hell if you have to remove the lfex ,and nearly always leak on refitment if you don,t replace them

I always use copper washers but I thought crush washers shouldn't be re-used?

11th June 2013, 14:03

the rover washers are solid alloy ones .
in a perfect world that you should fit new washers every time ,but in the same perfect world why would you use ally brake unions on s/s braided when you know there will be a corrosion problem to some degree .
race cars are not road cars and replacing all the pipes every year is of no matter for a works team with unlimited budget.same as using magnesium wheels --they need to be crack tested every year and are lifed at 3 years or replacing all the sherical joints on a rally car every few events.

all that is in question is how fast it will happen

11th June 2013, 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross

I was fully braided, and have gone back to copper throughout (except for the flex parts obviously!). Much neater, and technically both stronger and better. You can run a bias valve with copper no problem just plumb it in as you were thinking for the braided. But what's the requirement for the bias valve if you don't mind me asking?

Quote:

Originally Posted by axsaxoman

rears should lock microscopically before the fronts ,so you can actually turn in under braking ,if needed ,and drift the rear end to point the front where you want it

This. Currently adjusting the one on the beam is a pig and im not sure how accurate it is. If i get one mounted in the car like so and get it set up correctly once i will be happy

11th June 2013, 15:47

Ah makes sense!

22nd July 2014, 14:36

Just to let you all know that Speedflow in the UK import all the braided hose and most of there fittings from Golden Bloom in China. Just the same cheap stuff that you will get from Torques on Ebay or any other ebay seller. Be sure you get branded parts from a reputable supplier.

Have a good day

23rd July 2014, 00:52

And just to let up know I've banned your account so you can't spread any more libellous shite on this forum.

Have a good day.

23rd July 2014, 08:48

I have braided lines throughout on mine, mainly as I think it looks tidier than copper. After having bought the full setup, which wasnt cheap, I was reading about on comparisons between the two and copper is the better performer as it cannot flex/ bulge under load which braided can.

If I was to do it again I would go with copper

23rd July 2014, 10:06

Agreed - copper is the best solution by far. Cheapest, strongest, less hassle, easier to replace. But doesn't have that bling look everyone wants

Worse of course is when people then use alloy fittings on their steel overbraided hoses for yet more bling... Bad idea.