Important! : Citroen Saxo 1.5D Cold Start Problem White Smoke.

1. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

   #1 18th May 2015, 01:46

   My Citroen Saxo 1.5 Diesel 2003 has cold starting problem.
   
   When i start the car for the first time after 4 hours or so or in the morning it wont start unless the accelerater is pressed/released realy fast and hard about 10 times or more and when the car does start there is white smoke from the exhaust pipe.
   
   The starting problem and the smoke only occur for the first start of the day after the first start the car starts perfectly and there is no smoke what so ever.
   
   I have changed the fuel filter but made no difference, i have checked battery it is fine, i have checked the volts on the glow plugs they are fine.
   
   Any ideas or help would be appreciated.
2. chinkostu Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 The wrong carpark Posts: 5152 Xantia 1.9TD

   #2 18th May 2015, 06:52

   Both hot and cold? Seems like you've got fuel leaking back when it's sat

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3. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

   #3 18th May 2015, 07:11

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by chinkostu Both hot and cold? Seems like you've got fuel leaking back when it's sat

   
   Hi thanks for the reply,no it only smokes and not start when its cold ie left turned Of for 5 hours or moRE.
4. vincent1 L-plater Joined: Nov 2014 Posts: 68

   #4 18th May 2015, 08:58

   testing the volts to the glow plugs isnt really a good enough test you really need to remove the wire from the top of each glow plug and test the ohms or remove each glow plug and test across a 12 volt battery.

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5. user_20080 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Dec 2007 smurfland. Posts: 17346 Ex saxo owner.

   #5 18th May 2015, 10:06

   Also it won't hurt to run some FORTE injector cleaner through the system.

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6. chinkostu Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 The wrong carpark Posts: 5152 Xantia 1.9TD

   #6 18th May 2015, 21:31

   try priming the system next time its been sat (use the plunger/bulb wherever it is!)
   
   if it fires up first time then the diesel is leaking back.
   
   
   if its the same i'd be more inclined to say glowplugs. does it just crank over and over?
7. Milney8989 Regular Poster Joined: Mar 2015 Rayleigh Posts: 328 Saxo vts x2 Vauxhall Astra Ford mondeo workhorse

   #7 18th May 2015, 21:47

   I'd give the oil a good flush through then change it along with filter. Then give the engine a de carbon treatment that will probably help.
8. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

   #8 19th May 2015, 06:34

   Thanks for all the replays, the ohms are all constant on all the glow plugs i think it was 1.5 or sumting like that, there is no air in the fuel system, the priming bulb is firm, i have just changed the fuel filter a few days ago, the car is going into the garage today will report back on what the problem was.
9. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

   #9 19th May 2015, 06:35

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by Milney8989 I'd give the oil a good flush through then change it along with filter. Then give the engine a de carbon treatment that will probably help.

   
   Will try carbon treatment sounds like a plan. thanks.
10. chinkostu Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 The wrong carpark Posts: 5152 Xantia 1.9TD

    #10 19th May 2015, 07:38

    Ah right. Maybe the glowplug relays goosed?
    
    Whip them out and bench test the plugs, then wire a lamp into the glowplug wiring and see if that lights up with the relay
    
    The only other thing could be valve clearances but im not sure if it affects the TUD

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11. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #11 19th May 2015, 08:58

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chinkostu Ah right. Maybe the glowplug relays goosed? Whip them out and bench test the plugs, then wire a lamp into the glowplug wiring and see if that lights up with the relay The only other thing could be valve clearances but im not sure if it affects the TUD

    
    
    I have changed the glow plug relay last when the car was doing the same thing, it was turned out not be the glow plug relay.
12. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #12 19th May 2015, 09:00

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dhullu I have changed the glow plug relay last year when the car was doing the same thing, it was turned out not be the glow plug relay.

    sorry meant to say 'i chnaged the glow plug relay last year when the car was doing the same shows'.
13. user_20080 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Dec 2007 smurfland. Posts: 17346 Ex saxo owner.

    #13 19th May 2015, 17:56

    Sticking injector on cold start maybe causing the problem.
14. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #14 19th May 2015, 23:42

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chinkostu try priming the system next time its been sat (use the plunger/bulb wherever it is!) if it fires up first time then the diesel is leaking back. if its the same i'd be more inclined to say glowplugs. does it just crank over and over?

    
    yep keeps cranking over and over and then boom white smoke rushs out of the exhaust pipe and presto starts.
15. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #15 19th May 2015, 23:52

    Should have listened to you and not payed the garagE 50 euros for looking, been told by the garage it was the glow plugs relay, i took it off and the positive connector was burned out, i further dismantled the relay and realised that a small componnant (i think its a conductor what ever that is) had fallen off the circuit board and also found that the negative wire had come off completely. Tomorrow i am going to buy another glow plug relay second hand for around 20-30 euros, will report back after fitting to confirm it was 100% the relay at fault.
    
    My question is, would my car start without a glow plug relay?
    
    Thank you everyone for taking time out and helping me with this.
16. user_20080 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Dec 2007 smurfland. Posts: 17346 Ex saxo owner.

    #16 20th May 2015, 11:08

    The glow plug relay is what sends the current to the plugs enabling them to glow.

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17. chinkostu Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 The wrong carpark Posts: 5152 Xantia 1.9TD

    #17 20th May 2015, 18:03

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dhullu Should have listened to you and not payed the garagE 50 euros for looking, been told by the garage it was the glow plugs relay, i took it off and the positive connector was burned out, i further dismantled the relay and realised that a small componnant (i think its a conductor what ever that is) had fallen off the circuit board and also found that the negative wire had come off completely. Tomorrow i am going to buy another glow plug relay second hand for around 20-30 euros, will report back after fitting to confirm it was 100% the relay at fault. My question is, would my car start without a glow plug relay? Thank you everyone for taking time out and helping me with this.

    You get no preheat and makes it really tough to start
    
    Might be worth checking the associated wiring too

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18. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #18 22nd May 2015, 12:41

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chinkostu Ah right. Maybe the glowplug relays goosed? Whip them out and bench test the plugs, then wire a lamp into the glowplug wiring and see if that lights up with the relay The only other thing could be valve clearances but im not sure if it affects the TUD

    You hit the nail on the head it was exactly the glow plug relay
19. dhullu Newbie Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 14

    #19 22nd May 2015, 12:47

    OK problem solved it was the glow plug relay (the positive connector burnt out after the negative connetor stopped making contact or sumting like that) i changed it and starts no problems what so ever.
    
    I put a bosh on which i bought for 20euros from a local ad, i had to make slight mods to the plastic on the back as it was slightly longer then the one i was sup to get but it took 5 mins, i was gona get the exact one in the car before but no one had it in stock and it was around 60 euros. I think long as the glow plug relay is 12v it will work, the one i put in has 5 connectors and the one that was not working had on 4 but it seems to have not made any dif infact the car starts better and quicker now.
    
    Thank you guys for all the help.
20. chinkostu Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Aug 2008 The wrong carpark Posts: 5152 Xantia 1.9TD

    #20 23rd May 2015, 13:18

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dhullu OK problem solved it was the glow plug relay (the positive connector burnt out after the negative connetor stopped making contact or sumting like that) i changed it and starts no problems what so ever. I put a bosh on which i bought for 20euros from a local ad, i had to make slight mods to the plastic on the back as it was slightly longer then the one i was sup to get but it took 5 mins, i was gona get the exact one in the car before but no one had it in stock and it was around 60 euros. I think long as the glow plug relay is 12v it will work, the one i put in has 5 connectors and the one that was not working had on 4 but it seems to have not made any dif infact the car starts better and quicker now. Thank you guys for all the help.

    
    No worries! Currently running two diesels myself so have a rough idea of what to do