Better handbrake for turns in Citroen Saxo VTS

1. steffeen L-plater Joined: Jan 2018 Posts: 58

   #1 9th April 2018, 12:28

   Hello Saxperience
   Since I'm going rallying in my Citroen Saxo 98hp from 2001 VTS I have realised my handbrake is no good.
   
   We're doing alot of handbrake turns and the handbrake needs 7-8 clicks before it blocks the wheels,
   
   Anyone know an idea for better handbrake in the saxo? I have adjusted the cable but it is loosing really quick..
   
   Im running Nankang NS2R wheels and standard brake,
   Would DS2500 brake pads perform better handbrake turns?
2. MartinObviously Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2012 Perth Posts: 3665 Peugeot 106 1.1 Turbo Peugeot 106 1.5D Turbo Peuge

   #2 9th April 2018, 17:41

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by steffeen Hello Saxperience Since I'm going rallying in my Citroen Saxo 98hp from 2001 VTS I have realised my handbrake is no good. We're doing alot of handbrake turns and the handbrake needs 7-8 clicks before it blocks the wheels, Anyone know an idea for better handbrake in the saxo? I have adjusted the cable but it is loosing really quick.. Im running Nankang NS2R wheels and standard brake, Would DS2500 brake pads perform better handbrake turns?

   Either fit drums or get a hydraulic handbrake.
   
   The handbrake is designed for parking, and on the disc variant it's absolutely terrible no matter what you do to it.
3. Ben_SaxoForte Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Mar 2009 Stoke-on-trent Posts: 2640 Mk5 Golf GTTDI Mk2 VTR Project

   #3 9th April 2018, 18:47

   Yeah, best off fitting a hydraulic handbrake if you're gonna be pulling on it a lot otherwise you'll just end up stretching the wire or breaking it off.
4. karl_mh Infrequent Poster Joined: Mar 2018 Wirral Posts: 151 106 GTI - 106 GTI shell - New 106 Rallye shell

   #4 9th April 2018, 20:40

   Hydraulic handbrake is the only way! another interesting fact....one of my drinking buddies is an MOT tester and has recently been on refresher training and pointed out that testers are now paying extra attention to Rally / track vehicles, specifically handbrakes! for many years i have had Mk1 & Mk2 escort rally cars with hydraulic handbrakes and had no issues as even the MOT tester was satisfied that it had a mechanical latch to hold the hydraulics on, however, i am informed that the vehicle must have mechanical means of holding the handbrake.
   
   I am currently building a 106 Gti track / sprint car that will be used on the road so i will be installing the standard handbrake including cable mechanism (the lever will be shortened to give additional space for my hydraulic unit) to avoid any issues during the MOT.
   
   Here is my current set up.
5. steffeen L-plater Joined: Jan 2018 Posts: 58

   #5 10th April 2018, 07:19

   Thx guys, I really want a hydraulic handbrake - but it is not allowed in the low end class as I'm currently running.
   
   So I'm looking for improvement to the handbrake as standard.
6. welshpug Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Jul 2010 South Wales Posts: 3078 ZX 16v, 205 GTI, 309 Goodwood, 405 MI16.

   #6 10th April 2018, 14:32

   use Drums.
7. welshpug Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Jul 2010 South Wales Posts: 3078 ZX 16v, 205 GTI, 309 Goodwood, 405 MI16.

   #7 10th April 2018, 14:33

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by karl_mh the vehicle must have mechanical means of holding the handbrake.

   this has always been the case, never has a latch on a hydraulic cylinder been acceptable.

   1 user thanked this post: MartinObviously
8. sri_130 Frequent Poster Joined: Apr 2012 Doyncaster Posts: 783

   #8 10th April 2018, 15:44

   secondary rear calipers.
9. karl_mh Infrequent Poster Joined: Mar 2018 Wirral Posts: 151 106 GTI - 106 GTI shell - New 106 Rallye shell

   #9 10th April 2018, 19:36

   You are correct welshpug! What I was trying to say is that I've had my escorts MOT'd by many different MOT stations over the years and had no issues with the hydraulic unit with the mechanical latch that was fitted although the regulation (as you mention) was already in place. As with my 106...I have the the original mountings still in place so I'm installing the origonal set up to avoid disappointment at the MOT station
10. user_98505 Regular Poster Joined: Sep 2015 Posts: 269 106 Rallye

    #10 11th April 2018, 09:02

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sri_130 secondary rear calipers.

    I was going to say fit front calipers on the rear, or go drums and get used to changing the cable often when you stretch the life out of it.
11. steffeen L-plater Joined: Jan 2018 Posts: 58

    #11 12th April 2018, 08:52

    It's not allowed to modify the original brakes, only fit new disc / pads.
    That's why im looking for some better brakes which would grip better for the handbrake. I was thinking EBC yellowstuff or Ferodo DS2500/DS Performance
    
    Or does anyone have an alternative?
    The brakes should be for short circuit runs with alot of time not braking so the operating temperature is not high all the time
12. MartinObviously Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2012 Perth Posts: 3665 Peugeot 106 1.1 Turbo Peugeot 106 1.5D Turbo Peuge

    #12 12th April 2018, 17:44

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by steffeen It's not allowed to modify the original brakes, only fit new disc / pads. That's why im looking for some better brakes which would grip better for the handbrake. I was thinking EBC yellowstuff or Ferodo DS2500/DS Performance Or does anyone have an alternative? The brakes should be for short circuit runs with alot of time not braking so the operating temperature is not high all the time

    What's the definition of "original"? Normally that means you can use original equipment only, which means you could fit a standard drum setup.
    
    details of series and regs pl0x
13. steffeen L-plater Joined: Jan 2018 Posts: 58

    #13 13th April 2018, 08:08

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by MartinObviously What's the definition of "original"? Normally that means you can use original equipment only, which means you could fit a standard drum setup. details of series and regs pl0x

    The series im running is Class 1 rally in Denmark which is light rally with street cars (My class). The car should be a legal road car so I can fit everything original (Brake sizes etc).
    Drums could be an option, how much work is there to fit drums instead?
    
    Bigger brake disc, engine changes like turbo and so on is not allowed.

    1 user thanked this post: MartinObviously
14. steffeen L-plater Joined: Jan 2018 Posts: 58

    #14 13th April 2018, 08:09

    The serie is called Klubrally Class 1 (Beginner) and you can drive in that class for 2 years to gain experience with rally before going further into the sport.

    1 user thanked this post: MartinObviously
15. MartinObviously Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Dec 2012 Perth Posts: 3665 Peugeot 106 1.1 Turbo Peugeot 106 1.5D Turbo Peuge

    #15 14th April 2018, 19:33

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by steffeen The series im running is Class 1 rally in Denmark which is light rally with street cars (My class). The car should be a legal road car so I can fit everything original (Brake sizes etc). Drums could be an option, how much work is there to fit drums instead? Bigger brake disc, engine changes like turbo and so on is not allowed.

    To fit drum, you can either swap the whole axle to a drum style - which isn't a lot of work really.
    
    OR you get the drums, back plate, shoes etc and the shorter stub pins. The stub end has a dimple so you can hammer out the longer, with a drift, ones for disc style.
    
    The shorter drums ones simply hammer in.
    
    few hours work.