Which camshafts do you recommend

1. ers10weys91 L-plater Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 89

   #1 27th January 2012, 22:57

   What is the model I can get the best power for the standard engine?
   Use standard followers and valve springs
   
   1-kent cams pt51 (262-262)
   2-pipercams (260-260)
   3-catcams 1321708 (256-256)
   4-colombo bariani (260-260)
   5-newman cams ph1 (256-256)
   
   thanks
2. logic_guy Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Nov 2010 England Posts: 3423

   #2 27th January 2012, 23:30

   I'm assuming a VTS engine with 'Camshafts' and catcams 1321708 in the list?
   
   I think many people would say say catcams 1321708 are the better ones. I think you'll need a re-map after to get the most out of your upgrade.
3. Tom5190 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Sep 2007 Someones Bumhole Posts: 5721 Mk2 16v Desire

   #3 28th January 2012, 00:32

   cat cam 743's is what you want!
4. willis54 Regular Poster Joined: Dec 2011 Swadlincote Posts: 260 MK1 1.4i Westie Mango

   #4 28th January 2012, 01:35

   Cat cam 708
5. Jack Frequent Poster Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 937 NA

   #5 28th January 2012, 09:00

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by willis54 Cat cam 708

   Cat Cams have released a new set of camshafts - the 743, it's supposed to be slightly better than the 708:
   
   http://www.kamracing.co.uk/citroen/c...s-1321743.html
6. user_10176 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Jun 2006 Ramsey st marys, peterborough Posts: 8288 Saxo's, Corsa (Daily)

   #6 28th January 2012, 14:52

   Also Newman ph1 are not the same as the 708.
   
   It the ph3 you should be looking at.
7. gato_xsi Newbie Joined: Nov 2011 Posts: 5

   #7 29th January 2012, 00:49

   kent cames pt 52 or piper cames bp300h also cat 715
8. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

   #8 29th January 2012, 07:20

   Quote:

   Originally Posted by gato_xsi kent cames pt 52 or piper cames bp300h also cat 715

   Neither of which are designed for standard springs and followers.
9. ers10weys91 L-plater Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 89

   #9 29th January 2012, 14:05

   this model cat708
   Is the approach to the power of pt52
10. user_32315 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Mar 2009 Uppingham, Rutland Posts: 9569 mk1 JP4'd VTR, '16 Fabia Monte Carlo

    #10 29th January 2012, 18:35

    only cams id look at are the 743's tbh i have 708's but annoyingly enough i bought these a few months before the 743's were released
11. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #11 30th January 2012, 11:10

    catcam 1321708 and catcam 1321743 are about the limit to what profile you can fit physically in the head without modifying other components. I've not seen people get better results than this design. Catcams use one of (if not the) the most advanced cam lobe design software in the world so it would be my no1 choice. Put it this way. Out of all the manufacturers I could use, I get Cat cams to make my custom camshafts.
    
    Kev
12. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #12 30th January 2012, 11:42

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AndySAXO Also Newman ph1 are not the same as the 708. It the ph3 you should be looking at.

    I'm actually pretty interested in the PH1's but no one I know of has installed them. Interested to see the results.
13. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #13 30th January 2012, 12:33

    The ph1 is a mild cam. Expect a couple of bhp gain, nothing more. Its one of those mods that will make you a bit faster than a standard car, but you wont be able to notice any seat of your pants difference.
14. yr51ocw Frequent Poster Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 751

    #14 30th January 2012, 13:07

    what software do catcams use? GTValvetrain or similar?
15. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #15 30th January 2012, 13:33

    The owner of Cat cams writes his own. He's bought and used them all and theres nothing on the market he feels is good enough.
16. user_51379 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Mar 2011 plymouth Posts: 2921 mk2 VTS

    #16 30th January 2012, 13:41

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KamRacing catcam 1321708 and catcam 1321743 are about the limit to what profile you can fit physically in the head without modifying other components. I've not seen people get better results than this design. Catcams use one of (if not the) the most advanced cam lobe design software in the world so it would be my no1 choice. Put it this way. Out of all the manufacturers I could use, I get Cat cams to make my custom camshafts. Kev

    which one is better though 708's or 743's
17. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #17 30th January 2012, 13:54

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KamRacing The ph1 is a mild cam. Expect a couple of bhp gain, nothing more. Its one of those mods that will make you a bit faster than a standard car, but you wont be able to notice any seat of your pants difference.

    Sounds good to me - I wasn't sure if it was a mildly OEM cam with a bit of marketing gimmicky behind it.
    
    Regarding PH3,s 708, 743 etc, too much emphasis on that peak figure. I still want a car that's got good torque at low revs. Driveability basically.
18. user_36879 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Aug 2009 Ascot Posts: 4619 Mint 106 rallye, Saxo VTR

    #18 30th January 2012, 14:10

    cat cams 743
    newman ph3
19. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #19 30th January 2012, 14:10

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sam_16v which one is better though 708's or 743's

    1321743 are better. The cam lobes are a new shape which gives better results
    
    

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Barry123 Sounds good to me - I wasn't sure if it was a mildly OEM cam with a bit of marketing gimmicky behind it. Regarding PH3,s 708, 743 etc, too much emphasis on that peak figure. I still want a car that's got good torque at low revs. Driveability basically.

    If you want low down torque to carry fat birds then you need a diesel. The Cat cams will improve both mid and top end power, basically the revs you spend most of your time in when driving at any sort of pace. If you are sticking to 1500-2000 rpm then you should not be fitting any cams whatsoever.

    1 user thanked this post: user_51379
20. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #20 30th January 2012, 14:29

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KamRacing 1321743 are better. The cam lobes are a new shape which gives better results If you want low down torque to carry fat birds then you need a diesel. The Cat cams will improve both mid and top end power, basically the revs you spend most of your time in when driving at any sort of pace. If you are sticking to 1500-2000 rpm then you should not be fitting any cams whatsoever.

    I haz diesel (well access to one)
    Even the ph1's Kammy?
21. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #21 30th January 2012, 15:04

    I just dont see the point of fitting cams which give so little gain.
22. user_51379 Saxperience Forum Bum Joined: Mar 2011 plymouth Posts: 2921 mk2 VTS

    #22 30th January 2012, 15:16

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KamRacing 1321743 are better. The cam lobes are a new shape which gives better results If you want low down torque to carry fat birds then you need a diesel. The Cat cams will improve both mid and top end power, basically the revs you spend most of your time in when driving at any sort of pace. If you are sticking to 1500-2000 rpm then you should not be fitting any cams whatsoever.

    thanks mate 743's for me it is then
23. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #23 30th January 2012, 15:56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KamRacing I just dont see the point of fitting cams which give so little gain.

    With respect, I don't see the point in fitting cams which make the car a pain in arse around town (which lets face it, is where most cammed cars stay 90% of the time). I've driven a 708'd engine, it wasn't amazing. I'm not chasing power figures. I get a chunkier bit of torque where I need it, I keep driveability, yay
    
    Problem is, I can't get a definitive answer what the typical increase in torque/power actually is...
24. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

    #24 30th January 2012, 16:05

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Barry123 With respect, I don't see the point in fitting cams which make the car a pain in arse around town (which lets face it, is where most cammed cars stay 90% of the time). I've driven a 708'd engine, it wasn't amazing. I'm not chasing power figures. I get a chunkier bit of torque where I need it, I keep driveability, yay Problem is, I can't get a definitive answer what the typical increase in torque/power actually is...

    Budget low boost set up ladyboy.
    
    DIY it.
25. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #25 30th January 2012, 16:23

    ah yes, I'll just raid the imaginary bank account with £5k in it. Thanks for the heads up
26. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

    #26 30th January 2012, 16:23

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Barry123 ah yes, I'll just raid the imaginary bank account with £5k in it. Thanks for the heads up

    A DIY low boost set up is no where near that dude. Dont want to derail thread more but there are ways espec if staying low boost
27. Barry123 Saxperience Hardcore! Joined: Oct 2005 Aycliffe Posts: 32205 Saxo VTS

    #27 30th January 2012, 16:24

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ryan A DIY low boost set up is no where near that dude.

    Shock me then dingham.
28. KamRacing Saxperience Addict Joined: Nov 2006 A farm shed in Aylesbury Posts: 14916 Corolla AE86 Peugeot 205 B18C (in bits)

    #28 30th January 2012, 16:42

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Barry123 With respect, I don't see the point in fitting cams which make the car a pain in arse around town (which lets face it, is where most cammed cars stay 90% of the time). I've driven a 708'd engine, it wasn't amazing. I'm not chasing power figures. I get a chunkier bit of torque where I need it, I keep driveability, yay Problem is, I can't get a definitive answer what the typical increase in torque/power actually is...

    3-5bhp. expensive for little gain. If you want standard oe driving experience then stay standard
29. Gabbastard Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Dec 2002 United Kingdom Posts: 8390

    #29 30th January 2012, 16:44

    I used to have Kent PT50s and a Peugeot Sport ECU, think theyd be roughly similar profile to ph1. Seemed to make a little bit of a difference when twinned with the ECU, but nothing major.
    
    Fit some manly cams. Ive a set of the Piper 285 for mine.
30. Sophia_Bush Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Jan 2007 Shropshire Posts: 9994 Moonstone Blue 106 GTi

    #30 30th January 2012, 17:15

    had piper 270s in my old old gti that with miltek 4 branch magnex system and raceland induction was remapped at chipwizards with cam timing tweaked made 140 odd bhp it went ok for what it was got used to it fast though
31. Tom5190 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Sep 2007 Someones Bumhole Posts: 5721 Mk2 16v Desire

    #31 30th January 2012, 23:00

    Im using 743's (was the first with them in) and there really good, if im honest listening to the idle you would be hard pushed to notice any difference than the standard idle (it is abit higher and im talking after a map)
32. ers10weys91 L-plater Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 89

    #32 31st January 2012, 19:40

    What exactly is the difference
    708-743
    
    Cat Cams Duration Duration Max Lift
    Part no @ 1.0mm+cl @0.1mm
    1321743 256° / 256° 230° / 230° 10.00 / 10.00 mm
    
    writes the same in both?
33. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

    #33 31st January 2012, 19:46

    That's a fault on the website Tom said when someone mentioned this previously.
34. mangojace Established Member Joined: Mar 2011 Hampshire Posts: 1484

    #34 31st January 2012, 20:05

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ryan Neither of which are designed for standard springs and followers.

    Correct, i use 52's. Saw your car tonight
35. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

    #35 31st January 2012, 20:08

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mangojace Correct, i use 52's. Saw your car tonight

    Think most people have seen it more than me in the last 6months haha.
    
    The 715 quoted in the post were used on hydros mind but a few pete found the 708 was a better cam. Just to correct myself.
36. mangojace Established Member Joined: Mar 2011 Hampshire Posts: 1484

    #36 31st January 2012, 20:19

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ryan Think most people have seen it more than me in the last 6months haha. The 715 quoted in the post were used on hydros mind but a few pete found the 708 was a better cam. Just to correct myself.

    Haha bless mate. Looks nice, you tracking it this year?
37. Tom5190 Saxperience Post Whore Joined: Sep 2007 Someones Bumhole Posts: 5721 Mk2 16v Desire

    #37 31st January 2012, 20:20

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ryan That's a fault on the website Tom said when someone mentioned this previously.

    Kam said that these were correct just the lobe shape is different to a 708
38. Ryanp Super Moderator Joined: Feb 2004 Tonbridge United Kingdom (England) Posts: 38236 Vtr, 172, throttle bodied track slut

    #38 31st January 2012, 20:24

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mangojace Haha bless mate. Looks nice, you tracking it this year?

    It looks shit, but I'm not fussed about that.
    
    Plan is to get it used again soon, just depends when martins got time to finish it off then I sort the cage etc..
39. xxo0pko0xx Established Member Joined: May 2009 cleethorpes, Lincolnshire Posts: 1830 Astra 2006 (55) 1.9 cdti 150 sri 192hp 322ftlb

    #39 3rd February 2012, 17:25

    none
    newmans ph4s are the best gains