98BHP vs 90BHP Modding ?

15th March 2012, 15:20

i was wondering if fitting the 90 bhp exhaust system (cat under car) would be possible on the 98bhp engine ? as the 98bhp engine has the Manicat, i dont want to de-cat it as i find it tends to ruin the fuel economy, but if i could fit the phase 1 exhaust system on the phase 2 car, i could use a 4 branch manifold, and a CAT back system and this would probably make it easier to de-cat in the future aswell wouldn't it just been under the car as normal ? if its possible to do so ?

15th March 2012, 15:32

yea you need to change your oil filter to the early type

theres a guide somewere i think

15th March 2012, 15:38

I've been wondering this...

Would it pass an MOT like this??

15th March 2012, 15:43

ahh i see, just looking for the guide now, would the lamda sensor wires need extending or anything ? or are they in the same locations

15th March 2012, 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriswindy

I've been wondering this...

Would it pass an MOT like this??

well if a mk1 passes emmisions with a mk1 exhasut then the mk2 will as well, its still got a cat just in a different place

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxobeet

ahh i see, just looking for the guide now, would the lamda sensor wires need extending or anything ? or are they in the same locations

iirc you would have to sleeve your second lambda sensor and mk1's only have one and yours should have 2

15th March 2012, 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriswindy

I've been wondering this...

Would it pass an MOT like this??

if you fit the under car cat for an mot yes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxobeet

ahh i see, just looking for the guide now, would the lamda sensor wires need extending or anything ? or are they in the same locations

mine didnt need extending
got the front lamda in the manifold the second is sleeved and tied onto the battery tray

15th March 2012, 15:59

ah i see, what if i "manufactured" (bodged) the second lamda sensor into the exhaust in the relevant location and extended the wires, would this also keep the engine adjusting fueling right and keep the engine warning light off ?

15th March 2012, 16:07

the sleeve should keep the light off thats what its designed to do iirc

15th March 2012, 16:11

ahh okay, il probably refit it into the exhaust anyways as this would help emissions wouldnt it ? and i cant seem to find anywhere that sells the adaptor to fit the screw on filter onto the block :\ aha

15th March 2012, 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxobeet

ahh okay, il probably refit it into the exhaust anyways as this would help emissions wouldnt it ? and i cant seem to find anywhere that sells the adaptor to fit the screw on filter onto the block :\ aha

the part number should be in the guide if you get it then go to Citroen and buy all the parts would be your best bet

15th March 2012, 19:52

okay i found it now thanks for the advice

16th March 2012, 11:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saxobeet

ahh okay, il probably refit it into the exhaust anyways as this would help emissions wouldnt it ? and i cant seem to find anywhere that sells the adaptor to fit the screw on filter onto the block :\ aha

no that would make the ecu think the cat has failed
the second lamda needs to read less than the first so sleeving means it reads the nornal.air in the sleeve
you can leave them open but water ect can damage the sensor

16th March 2012, 12:08

my phase 2 has a 4/2/1 manifold, then a supersprint midpipe etc.
my phase 1 has a standard exhaust. the midpipe is the same on ph1 as ph2.
i just pretend that the superprint midpipe is a decat pipe then come MOT time put the ph1 midpipe in, the silencer quietens it down alot and the cat seems to let it pass MOT.

after all, a catalyst helps to convert carbon monoxide into carbon dioxide. It converts the hydrocarbons into carbon dioxide and water. It also converts the nitrogen oxides back into nitrogen and oxygen doesnt really matter where it goes.

16th March 2012, 12:28

to do it properly weld a boss onto the exhaust and extend the wires, or use a mk2 vts system from the manifold back i think theyve got the second lambda location in the cat pipe

16th March 2012, 13:00

Ive done this on my furio with a mk2 1.4 engine cat in mani etc...
Changed to a 421 with cat under car then put only 1 of the lambda sensors into the hole in the manifold the second one isnt plugged in at all... No management light

However it didnt pass an mot as the rules are slightly different for the emmisions and they are usually close to failing anyway. This is because cat doesnt work as well under the car due to heat etc

16th March 2012, 13:23

I had lots of problems with doing this, I did exactly this with my MK2 and makign the Lambdas happy was incredilbly hard.

It depends which manifold you use.

Some have said if it works on a MK1 it will work on a MK2 well this is not correct coz consider that they also changed the ECU.

You have to use a manifold like the Raceland which has space for the top lambda at the top close to the cylinders, if you try using a Piper 4-1 like I did the top lambda is right the way down the pipe, so it will never get enough as it was designed to on the 3 plug car.

I even tried sleeving the lambda, cleared the codes and light stayed off for the MOT but it still failed on carbon monoxied from overfueling/running as the Lambda was too far down the pipe to get a proper reading for the 3 plug.

In the end, I put my oil filter back bought a new manifold CAT and it passed straight away with all the same Lambdas, wasn't worth the £300 quid I wasted on CATs and centre pipes I should have just done that in the first place.

16th March 2012, 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liamjrhodes

However it didnt pass an mot as the rules are slightly different for the emmisions and they are usually close to failing anyway. This is because cat doesnt work as well under the car due to heat etc

Most intelligent response and describes my problem exactly.

Need to remember that the emissions test levels are also different for the 2001 onwards cars as they produced better figures from the factory they expect them to produce this figure still, and not a higher one comparable to the mark 1s.

16th March 2012, 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeeM

to do it properly weld a boss onto the exhaust and extend the wires, or use a mk2 vts system from the manifold back i think theyve got the second lambda location in the cat pipe

And this is the perfect way to do it if you don't want to hang the lambda, however you may still have issues with the pre cat lambda getting hot enough to give accurate enough readings for the 3 plug ECU.

Bear in mind you will need a MK2 VTS centre pipe for this too as the inclusion of lambda makes for a longer CAT meaning a shorter centre pipe.

16th March 2012, 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveWC

I had lots of problems with doing this, I did exactly this with my MK2 and makign the Lambdas happy was incredilbly hard.

It depends which manifold you use.

Some have said if it works on a MK1 it will work on a MK2 well this is not correct coz consider that they also changed the ECU.

You have to use a manifold like the Raceland which has space for the top lambda at the top close to the cylinders, if you try using a Piper 4-1 like I did the top lambda is right the way down the pipe, so it will never get enough as it was designed to on the 3 plug car.

I even tried sleeving the lambda, cleared the codes and light stayed off for the MOT but it still failed on carbon monoxied from overfueling/running as the Lambda was too far down the pipe to get a proper reading for the 3 plug.

In the end, I put my oil filter back bought a new manifold CAT and it passed straight away with all the same Lambdas, wasn't worth the £300 quid I wasted on CATs and centre pipes I should have just done that in the first place.

Cheers for that Steve, actually got a proper answer

In the future AlexB and jeffchiz, if you don't know the answer, don't post.

16th March 2012, 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriswindy

Cheers for that Steve, actually got a proper answer

In the future AlexB and jeffchiz, if you don't know the answer, don't post.

Excuse me? What did I say that was wrong?

16th March 2012, 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriswindy

Cheers for that Steve, actually got a proper answer

In the future AlexB and jeffchiz, if you don't know the answer, don't post.

i have my vtr done exactly the way i have posted
it works so id say i do know the answer

been through 2 mots with the cat refitted and the lamdas left second one is sleeved and has never been in the exhaust since the mani was fitted

16th March 2012, 23:35

As Alexb said in our experiences its worked, so just because someone else has had a different experience were wrong?

16th March 2012, 23:37

typical sax-p jeff

if you dont have the exact answer they expect your wrong
even if your car works your wrong
tbh fuck it just give up your wrong

17th March 2012, 17:59

just to add to this

fitted a catch tank earlier and you can see my lamda under it in the sleeve

NEVER had a problem
fuck extending wires and pissing about
all i do is literally bolt a standard mark 1 exhaust on for mots

17th March 2012, 18:04

second lambda is just to test efficiencey fo cat anyway on the most part..just sleeve it